The Cellar - If Bush lied...so did they!

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Jebediah (Post 314743)

Hail Stalin!

Nobody thinks Iraq did it. Osama and his cronies did it. We we made to believe Saddam had ties to Al-Qaeda or gave some help to them and their kind. See here: http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/relea...0021007-8.html I will take time to point out that's no commie link either.

You talking about this quote....how does it link Saddam with 9/11?

Some citizens wonder, after 11 years of living with this problem, why do we need to confront it now? And there's a reason. We've experienced the horror of September the 11th. We have seen that those who hate America are willing to crash airplanes into buildings full of innocent people. Our enemies would be no less willing, in fact, they would be eager, to use biological or chemical, or a nuclear weapon.

Besides Lee Hamilton commision agreed that Saddam had some ties to terrorist Al-Qaeda included. Besides that everyone knows he sent money to dead suicide bombers families in the Middle East.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tw (Post 314768)

Ronald Cherrycoke promotes another George Jr lie. Obviously he has no idea about Muslim Brotherhood. If a president tells him Al Qaeda is in Iraq, then Ronald says, "Yes sir". Same president could not even name countries on Israel's border. But Ronald trusts this president.

If I want to sell more stones, I call them diamonds. It's called counterfeiting, Ronald. You are suppose to have enough grasp to understand the difference between a tiny Al Qaeda verses an Iraqi insurgency created (and maybe financed) by America. Oh. I forgot. Ronald only repeats what his idol tells him to. That Iraq insurgency has always been Al Qaeda out to kill us in our beds. Al Qaeda is all everywhere threatening to destroy the world. Maybe we should hire the Power Rangers to protect us? Ronald: Power Rangers ... fiction. Get it?

This Al Qaeda you promote only exists where fear promotes the glory and legacy of a mental midget. Those with basic knowledge knew this Al Qaeda you promote never existed except to promote more Orange Alerts. Ronald - you do remember all those terrorist attacks averted by Orange alerts? Oh. That's right. I forgot. This president does not lie.

Read? I only know how to write

Your tag sums up your mental midgetness...you should do more reading...if you can!

Quote:

The people upset at the prospect of dictator removal are fascist-sympathizing rats and nothing better -- lacking utterly in any higher human feeling.

Lacking in human feeling? How much human feeling is involved in bombing the capital city of a country? How many people died in a night of shock and awe?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanaC (Post 314786)

Lacking in human feeling? How much human feeling is involved in bombing the capital city of a country? How many people died in a night of shock and awe?

Gee...I didn`t know that wars kill civilians.
...ever wonder how many civilians.
in occupied Europe died by our bombs liberating them from Hitler?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronald Cherrycoke (Post 314778)

Besides Lee Hamilton commision agreed that Saddam had some ties to terrorist Al-Qaeda included. Besides that everyone knows he sent money to dead suicide bombers families in the Middle East.

Quote:

Ayman al-Zawahiri, deputy to Osama bin Laden, has declared Iraq a focus for al Qaeda

That is it. No other reference because bin Laden and Saddam had no such alliance - obviously. ISG makes no claim of a relationship between Saddam and Al Qaeda. Ronald invented it as only one from the dark side would do. Well Darth Cherrycoke, your claim is only found where anti-American extremist post hatred of both America and the American soldier. You are caught quoting an extremist lie. When will you first read from sources of reality? Why do you instead post wacko extremist propaganda? It is called lying. Others will tell you of my contempt for lies.

Ronald Cherrycoke would also have us believe that bin Laden's Al Qaeda is operating in Iraq and in a long list of other nations. That requires him to ignore (or confuse) what was known long before Iraq - the Muslim Brotherhood. That requires Ronald to believe what George Jr says. How active is bin Laden's Al Qaeda in Iraq? Again the Iraq Study Group:

Quote:

“Al Qaeda is now a franchise in Iraq, like McDonald’s.”

Yes I too can call myself Al Qaeda if to recruit wacko of extremists. Would that make me a member of bin Laden's Al Qaeda? If I call myself Wendy, then I must serve hamburgers? If I wear diapers, then I want Ann Coulter to do me?

Ronald Cherrycoke has been caught and exposed lying about the ISG report. Clearly he need not read before posting. He has Rush Limbaugh and Fox News to tell him. Or did Fox News have enough credibility to not report that lie?

Why has Ronald Cherrycoke not yet posted reasons to invade Iran? Ronald is waiting for his extremist newsletter to tell him what to say. Am I kidding? No. Not about extremists who have so much contempt for the American soldier. Ronald Cherrycoke has been caught lying even about the Iraq Study Group report. Worse? He probably believes his own lies because he could not bother to read. George Jr also believed god told him to invade Iraq. No wonder Ronald loves this president.

This post is not about Ronald Cherrycoke. This post is a warning to others about lies probably in the pipeline - that would explain the sudden deployment (surge) of aircraft carrier task forces to the Iranian coastline.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tw (Post 314823)

Wacko extremists will post Limbaugh lies with impunity. Ronald Cherrycoke has so little respect for everyone as to ... well those with too much bluster and to little grasp will even claim military service complete with medals. Ronald, your credibility is that diminished. Below is another example of your lying.

The "Lee Hamilton commission" did not agree "that Saddam had some ties to terrorist Al-Qaeda". Ronald glorifies extremism again by inventing reality. Ronald - a soundbyte so that you can understand: "Ronald is lying again".

Only reference to bin Laden by the Iraq Study Group is That is it. No other reference because bin Laden and Saddam had no such alliance - obviously. ISG makes no claim of a relationship between Saddam and Al Qaeda. Ronald invented it as only one from the dark side would do. Well Darth Cherrycoke, your claim is only found where anti-American extremist post hatred of both America and the American soldier. You are caught quoting an extremist lie. When will you first read from sources of reality? Why do you instead post wacko extremist propaganda? It is called lying. Others will tell you of my contempt for lies.

Ronald Cherrycoke would also have us believe that bin Laden's Al Qaeda is operating in Iraq and in a long list of other nations. That requires him to ignore (or confuse) what was known long before Iraq - the Muslim Brotherhood. That requires Ronald to believe what George Jr says. How active is bin Laden's Al Qaeda in Iraq? Again the Iraq Study Group: Yes I too can call myself Al Qaeda if to recruit wacko of extremists. Would that make me a member of bin Laden's Al Qaeda? If I call myself Wendy, then I must serve hamburgers? If I wear diapers, then I want Ann Coulter to do me?

Ronald Cherrycoke has been caught and exposed lying about the ISG report. Clearly he need not read before posting. He has Rush Limbaugh and Fox News to tell him. Or did Fox News have enough credibility to not report that lie?

Why has Ronald Cherrycoke not yet posted reasons to invade Iran? Ronald is waiting for his extremist newsletter to tell him what to say. Am I kidding? No. Not about extremists who have so much contempt for the American soldier. Ronald Cherrycoke has been caught lying even about the Iraq Study Group report. Worse? He probably believes his own lies because he could not bother to read. George Jr also believed god told him to invade Iraq. No wonder Ronald loves this president.

This post is not about Ronald Cherrycoke. This post is a warning to others about lies probably in the pipeline - that would explain the sudden deployment (surge) of aircraft carrier task forces to the Iranian coastline.

Wacko extremists will post Limbaugh lies with impunity. Ronald Cherrycoke has so little respect for everyone as to ... well those with too much bluster and to little grasp will even claim military service complete with medals. Ronald, your credibility is that diminished. Below is another example of your lying.

Told you I don`t listen to Limbaugh....the only Wacko extremists I see here is you . As far as military service..I don`t care if you believe me or not...if you got any questions on my service..fire away! But I do know that you as a coward have none.

The "Lee Hamilton commission" did not agree "that Saddam had some ties to terrorist Al-Qaeda". Ronald glorifies extremism again by inventing reality. Ronald - a soundbyte so that you can understand: "Ronald is lying again".

Read again his quote from a legitimate news source (Oh I forgot you don`t read just write)...and then bury your head in the sand again.

Only reference to bin Laden by the Iraq Study Group is That is it. No other reference because bin Laden and Saddam had no such alliance - obviously. ISG makes no claim of a relationship between Saddam and Al Qaeda. Ronald invented it as only one from the dark side would do. Well Darth Cherrycoke, your claim is only found where anti-American extremist post hatred of both America and the American soldier. You are caught quoting an extremist lie. When will you first read from sources of reality? Why do you instead post wacko extremist propaganda? It is called lying. Others will tell you of my contempt for lies.

That is it....yep they agreed there was a tie.

Well Darth Cherrycoke, your claim is only found where anti-American extremist post hatred of both America and the American soldier.

Strange stuff indeed...by the way you phrase and write I bet you are not even an American.

Ronald Cherrycoke has been caught and exposed lying about the ISG report. Clearly he need not read before posting. He has Rush Limbaugh and Fox News to tell him. Or did Fox News have enough credibility to not report that lie?

No but the MSM "Fake but Accurate" news might have.

Why has Ronald Cherrycoke not yet posted reasons to invade Iran? Ronald is waiting for his extremist newsletter to tell him what to say. Am I kidding? No. Not about extremists who have so much contempt for the American soldier. Ronald Cherrycoke has been caught lying even about the Iraq Study Group report. Worse? He probably believes his own lies because he could not bother to read. George Jr also believed god told him to invade Iraq. No wonder Ronald loves this president.

While you suck up to every slogan Al Franken spews....

This post is not about Ronald Cherrycoke.

Yeah it is...Duh!!!...you go on so long about me...you fear I might offer some truth in a debate and a lefty can`t stand that.

If I call myself Wendy, then I must serve hamburgers? If I wear diapers, then I want Ann Coulter to do me?

Strange stuff indeed!...But we live in an enlightened society...Go for it Dude!

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including Al Qaeda members, though there is apparently no evidence of his involvement in the terrible events of September 11, 2001. It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons. Should he succeed in that endeavor, he could alter the political and security landscape of the Middle East, which as we know all too well affects American security." --

Hillary Clinton, October 10, 2002

THERE WAS NO QUESTION in our minds that there was a relationship between Iraq and al Qaeda."

Those are the words of Thomas Kean, the Republican co-chairman of the September 11 Commission. He made the statement on July 22, 2004, 10 days after a New York Times headline declared, "9/11 Report Is Said to Dismiss Iraq-Qaeda Alliance," and a month after another headline in the same paper blared, "Panel Finds No Qaeda-Iraq Tie."

As you can see, Ronald, tw remains at all times pathetic. He hasn't the stuff to gainsay either of us, he does not think entirely rationally, and were he merely stupid, his errors anent American foreign policy would at least some of the time favor American interests -- but his errors never do. He's got an agenda, and that agenda is vehement antipatriotism. If you're a patriot, particularly if you're a Republican patriot, he'll try and shit on you. Unfortunately, starting as he does from the abyss, it generally only puts him into an absurd posture.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronald Cherrycoke (Post 314836)

Told you I don`t listen to Limbaugh....

You said many things also parroted by Limbaugh. Why should I believe a person who even intentionally misquoted Tom Kean for a political agenda? Ronald Cherrycoke - you do exactly what a brown shirt must do; complete with Goebel's techniques to promote lies.

Tom Kean did not say what you have intentionally taken out of context. Saddam and bin Laden had no alliance no matter how often you lie. Hell, you even deny the reality about a "Mission Accomplished" banner - as Rush tells you to do. But then Goebel's purpose also was lies - to pervert and rewrite reality - so that brown shirts would 'feel' they are intelligent. Same type people listen to Limbaugh.

You don't listen to Limbaugh. Oh. Its just an accident that you parrot what Liimbaugh told you to say. But then why should I believe anything Ronald Cherrycoke says. He even intentionally misquotes Tom Kean to promote 'big dic' extremism.

Worse than Nixon

Quote:

Q. Finally, I just want to get your reflections on the [famously contentious] relationship of Richard Nixon and the press. ... How does that compare to George W. Bush and the press?

BERNSTEIN: First, Nixon's relationship to the press was consistent with his relationship to many institutions and people. He saw himself as a victim. We now understand the psyche of Richard Nixon, that his was a self-destructive act and presidency.

I think what we're talking about with the Bush administration is a far different matter in which disinformation, misinformation and unwillingness to tell the truth -- a willingness to lie both in the Oval Office, in the Office of the Secretary of Defense, in the office of the vice president, the vice president himself -- is something that I have never witnessed before on this scale.

The lying in the Nixon White House had most often to do with covering up Watergate, with the Nixon administration's illegal activities. Here, in this presidency, there is an unwillingness to be truthful, both contextually and in terms of basic facts that ought to be of great concern to people of all ideologies. ...

This president has a record of dishonesty and obfuscation that is Nixonian in character in its willingness to manipulate the press, to manipulate the truth. We have gone to war on the basis of misinformation, disinformation and knowing lies from top to bottom.

That is an astonishing fact. That's what this story is about: the willingness of the president and the vice president and the people around them to try to undermine people who have effectively opposed them by telling the truth. It happened with [Sen.] John McCain in South Carolina. It happened with [Sen.] John Kerry. It's happened with [Sen.] Max Cleland in Georgia. It's happened with many other people. That's the real story, and that's the story that [the press] should have been writing. ...

It's very difficult, as a reporter, to get across that when you say, "This is a presidency of great dishonesty," that this is not a matter of opinion. This is demonstrable fact. If you go back and look at the president's statements, you look at the statements of the vice president, you look at the statements of Condoleezza Rice, you go through the record, you look at what [counterterrorism expert] Richard Clarke has written, you look at what we know -- it's demonstrable.

It's fact. Now, how do you quantify it? That's a different question.

But to me, if there is a great failure by the so-called mainstream press in this presidency, it's the unwillingness to look at the lies and disinformation and misinformation and add them up and say clearly, "Here's what they said; here's what the known facts were," because when that is done, you then see this isn't a partisan matter. This is a matter of the truth, particularly about this war. This is a presidency that is not willing to tell the truth very often if it is contrary to its interests. It's not about ideology from whence I say this.

It's about being a reporter and saying: "That's what the story is. Let's see what they said; let's see what the facts are." ...

Link

Quote:

Here, in this presidency, there is an unwillingness to be truthful, both contextually and in terms of basic facts that ought to be of great concern to people of all ideologies. ...

I think they've pulled this off by polarizing the country, this red/blue crap. It's still us against them, but now instead of us(people) vs them(politicians), it's the people vs the other people while the politicians escape clean. What they've done is divide and conquer.

People have gotten so vain, so self centered, they would let politicians destroy the country rather than admit voting for them was a mistake. So polarized, they feel if the guy they voted for is criticized, it reflects on them. NO IT DOESN'T.
I voted for both Nixon and Bush, the first time they ran. It's not my fault they turned around and fucked me....fucked US. You don't know what they will do... no matter what the Crystal ball says. You listen to the promises and make a choice but it's a crap shoot.

The best we can do is, if they fuck up, get on them about it, don't make excuses for them. Voting for them doesn't make it your fault, but defending and making excuses for bad behavior sure does.

The press is our watch dog, are they bias? They are people, they have opinions that creep into their writing but they are still competing to get the most facts. So if you read for comprehension, look for verifiable facts, be skeptical of speculation and for Gods sake don't wholesale dismiss them as being "the liberal press", you may not find the truth, but you're sure to discover some lies. Sure, it takes some effort on your part.... the truth isn't coming on a silver platter.

Left wing, right wing, conservative, liberal, democrat, republican... bullshit..... names that bring pigeon holes to mind. But everybody's parameters, for each pigeon hole are different, so if you and I talk about a liberal, we aren't talking about exactly the same thing. Wouldn't it be better to drop the labels and discuss the person or problem at hand, so we'd know where everyone stands?

People that say, my politician's end justifies the means, or the goal is worth the collateral damage, so don't question what they're doing, are at best stupid, if not unindicted co-conspirators.
And the defense, well the other guy would have been worse? Put down the tarot cards and step away. One - thats bullshit speculation. Two - that has nothing to do with the current problem, just a lame ass diversion.
No politician is going to please everybody, but don't make excuses for bad behavior. We should question everything the politicians do.... everything.

It's not about you, it always has been and always will be, about US. That's my :2cents: :2cents:

Quote:

Gee...I didn`t know that wars kill civilians.
...ever wonder how many civilians.
in occupied Europe died by our bombs liberating them from Hitler?

Too many. But here's the thing.....the Iraqis weren't being liberated from an occupying power....we are the occupying power.

Bruce, that was downright beautiful.