So you are saying that our political system gives us a choice between Kerry, who critics claim is an opportunistic lightweight, and Wow, way to go America!

Can we please have a Dean-McCain matchup in the next election!? No Bushies, no overly-liberal unelectable exotics, no neo-cons, no ex-Klansmen, no G-d driven fanatics, just two guys with different viewpoints, personal integrity and real honest-to-god populist ideals?

BTW, did you mean "Breck girl"?

I did, and it states that bad people come in all political shapes and sizes, and that numbers 1 and 4 of the world's bloodiest dicatators were at one point US allies. :3_eyes:

As for the Great Depression, thanks to the introduction of 'Socialism-lite', widespread famine was averted.

BTW, most of the New Deal was work-fare, not welfare.

That's great, Rich, but since you've already demonstrated a blatant ignorance of this recent history we can assume you're clueless about how it ended, too.

Don't make shit up, this is the Cellar.

By the way you did not "run the numbers" despite your claim, and we still await your findings about how other forms of government are just as deadly as Communism.

I don't really believe hes a bumblefuk Rich. Just making the point that to many Kerry really should have been the pres, I mean , Dems in office are just the natural order of things. Reps only get into office when the people lose their minds.


I did Fark that reference up though :blush:

Yeah, what he said.

You and that Brett girl. :3eye:

"recent history", is that some sort of oxymoron like "compassionate conservatism"? Excactly what did I make up? The New Deal? I didn't mention Stalin's earlier association with Hitler, but I didn't lie about his dealings with the US, either. Or our dealings with Chiang Kai-shek.

As for democracy, is the US prepared to support a democratic islamic state in Iraq if that is what the people elect? Is the president ready to deal with the mix of church and state when it's not his church?

Communism collapsed in 1989. Capitalism collapsed in 1929. The British policy of colonialism folded all throughout the 20th century. What is left and what is working?

ut, how come you;re being a dick to rich? will you be calling his kids sissies next? wtf?

slang, the fact that bush won is resultant from one thing and one thing only: stupid people breed faster.

why dont you join the army and go fight in his war.....you have a lot of extra free time and it seems like it would fit your penchant for gunplay AND republican chest thumping.

Understand, to me, arguing for Communism IS being a dick.

We used to think that stuff worked until we woke up and took a look around. India was starving to death until they denationalized their farming industry. Ethiopia didn't have the kind of famine problems that Live Aid was created to remedy... until they went Communist and nationalized their farming industry. The US never nationalized dick, and surprise, it turned out to be the right way to go. 70-80 years later we have basically done away with scarcity problems COMPLETELY, but because there were a few years of difficult economy four generations ago, extended by the (anyone? anyone?) Smoot-Hawley tariffs of 1930, Rich thinks he has it all figured out and it's the mean money-making capitalists keeping us down. Never mind that the less productive nations have spent all their time killing each other, the fact that a small handful of people died in 1931 means that the market is a failure and the equivalent of Stalinism.

Well, FUCK THAT KIND OF NOISE. Wake the fuck up, take a look around.

EVEN THE CHINESE ARE FUCKING CAPITALISTS NOW, AND IT IS GOING TO MAKE THEM RICH. No complaints about market economies in the far east... they've woken up and smelt the fucking coffee already. It's like they say, there are more Communists at Harvard than there are left in eastern Europe.

Yeah I know. It's tough seeing your guy lose. Be patient. There is another election coming. Get involved with the process, don't just be bitter.

I would seriously like to. My bro and two cousins are overseas. I'm too old right by the age limitations at this time, but with a little luck they'll change. I would seriously like to go in place of a young-married-with-children soldier.

In the coming months recruitment and enlisted numbers may decline. I'm already gearing up with a physical fitness program to pass a physical test, should the age limitations be changed.

You dont believe in the Iraq war and that's fine by me. You are obviously a sharp guy, that's your opinion. You have a lot of company here on the cellar. There are a lot of people that do support the war though. When I was visiting my brother I talked with as many soldiers as I could about going to Iraq. There was only one Kerry supporter that I ran into. The conversations were off duty and bro isnt an officer, so it's not like he or I could break their rocks over their answers.

The most common phrase I heard was "rather fight them over there than over here".

I'm sure they are all idiots too.

And....


Kerry lost.

You've heard of Amtrak, right? What the hell is wrong with you?

Rich, you weren't arguing for Communism, were you? It doesn't seem like it, but maybe I'm hallucinating.

And Slang, your stunt meant nothing in Pennsylvania. Congratulations!

I know. Some one else's in Ohio did. Don't be bitter though, there is another election coming. You can put your energies into electing the guy of your choice.

It is interesting and fun seeing you guys whine though. For months I read shit here that pissed me off and just let it slide. There are a lot of people here that dont like Bush. I can accept that. Why cant you accept that reasonable people from all over the country voted for Bush instead of Kerry? What, they were all fundies? Please.

I know, they'll all stupid. With that attitude and denial, the Dems will be losing even more elections in the near future.

And...

Kerry lost.

Because if you look at the fallout from the last four years, both short term and long term, you have to be fairly off balance to vote for that.

Secondly UT, read this, then look at the supporters. Then you might realize why capitalism, as it stands, is doomed. Or we are.

Who's bitter, Slang? I know Bush won, and completely accept that. I wrote a rather level-headed piece just after the election and purposely didn't say much about the aftermath on Cellar b/c of all the whining.

But here you come 3 weeks after the election to rub it in and to and post some prank photos with some ridiculous shit about Kerry and Communists...that's as bad as some of those moveon.org ads. It was funny at first, but now it's just stupid. You're getting exactly what you're giving right now.

The election is over...your boy won, but your vote didn't count towards getting him there. That's it. Enough. Enjoy your victory. Meanwhile, people like me are gearing up for '08...you should too, since your boy can't run again...yet.

There are a lot of off balance people here then.

One of the reasons I come here to the cellar is to learn why. Why do these people think such riduculous ideas? Where in the world are they coming from? They can't all be stupid communist bastards, so why is it they form these crazy opinions?

In asking these questions I've learned a lot about how many of you think and how you arrived at that thinking.

Maybe looking at the masses that elected Bush from the same perspective would help some of you.

But I dont think so.....because you just cant. You are smarter. And that is why you lose. And will probably continue to until you re-examin this attitude.

Sure, you're right. Learn the details about why people think you're wrong and develop a non confrontational way of explaining your position.

Without being condescending.

Then you might win. Maybe.

Good Syc. Getting involved does wonderful things for the grassroots orgs. I am still involved but not with 08 at this time. With 06. It seems we have to start working on operation "Good bye Ed".

This little stunt putting signs up in support of our candidate is really not a stunt. It's supporting our candidate. In this election it didnt matter. Maybe for the overall numbers but not for the electoral college, which is the key.

Both sides are gearing up and whatever the campaigns were this time around will be nothing compared to the next few.

It should be exciting and I look forward to volunteering more in the future.