Free College for Everyone!
 

Problems with this idea:

1. empty gesture by lame duck?
2. did you see what the Fed Gov did with Common Core?
3. are we going to decide which degrees qualify?
4. new program while old necessary programs are under attack?

5. A way to illustrate how Democrats support policies for the common folk, and the repubican goal is to screw the common folk?*

*Because you know the repubicans will try to kill this.

I'll pay more taxes to improve our national aggregate education. I do not look forward to a country run by a bunch of Robert 'Bobby' Boucher Jr.s

7. one size does not fit all

?

We did. The trades lost... again.

They're riding a pretty amazing oh-fer in the last few decades, of support and respect, and now in the name of helping the common folk.

I hate this idea so very much. It will continue to drive up the cost of a generalized education which for many--if not most--is not the right life path. Everyone should have an equal opportunity to go to college if they can hack it, but definitely not everyone should go to college.

Trade schools, like UT said.

There is so much work in the trades around here now. Welders and electricians are turning down work... I heard last night that a kid I know with a learning disability turned down a full ride to Div I baseball school because he knew he'd never do the college work. A gas company is paying for him to learn welding.

That is what a community college now does.

Its not a mandate that one must go to college. It is what we did when we changed the system to make public high schools. Back then, high school was what a junior college is today.

Didn't we go over where you're not supposed to make shit up?

The loss of trade high schools was a cruel blow to the country. If free to all community college were to become a reality, I can see it going the way of for-profit prisons. That's an ugly picture. :eyebrow:

You can get a lot of trade training at your local JVS/Adult Division. HVAC, nursing, Tooling and Machining, Business and Medical Office.

The problem, as I see it, is the proprietary (for profits...your Miami Jacobs and the like) schools charging an arm and a leg for credits that will never transfer to a 4 year (say, if someone wants to go on after getting their LPN.)

I am under the impression that this free college IS for community colleges, and probably would also apply to Adult Ed at the JVS. Are there a lot of people in CC who have no business in college? Damn straight, but it's the lure of the low cost, being reimbursed for any Pell grant you didn't use, and the ability to use the ever-wily Cost Of Education to get federal backed student loans (with default rates through the roof)...it's the lure of the money. How about 'so, hey, you really want to go to CC to better yourself? Great, tuition and books are covered. No, you're not going to have extra loan money to buy a big screen. Still interested?'

It's not going to have much to do with your more elite schools; very few students, if any, get an associates from their CC then transfer to an Ivy League school.

It may be that trade schools are included in this, let us see what happens.

Probably a moot point with the current congress. :rolleyes:

Are you still hurting because your WMD myths were exposed as bogus znc obvious lies?

UT, you have been nasty lately for no good reason. In a previous post, I said *Apparently*. That was proof that I said "definitely"? No, You failed to read what was posted. You added a useful fact - as an adult would do. What was once six inspectors is now 80. But then you added cheapshots as an adult who is still a child would do.

Please stop posting emotions. They are irrelevant. Are inconsistent with who you have been. And contribute nothing to this thread.

Once 8 years of education was sufficient. Radical to other civilized (ie European) nations was what America pioneered - 12 years of education. It created what the world had never seen - major innovations on a scale unmatched in history.

Making standard 14 years of education is only expanding on trends mostly pioneered in America.

We know from history that world leading nations invest more time in education. This expansion to 14 years is consistent with previous and proven trends. To say this is harmful is unjustified by facts - is supported here only by speculation.

If expanding a standard education to 14 years is harmful or destructive, then some facts must exist to contradict trends proven by history.

14+2=16

Grades 1-12 plus Kinder = 13?

I get nasty when you make shit up.

For example, you've just made up the idea that you said "apparently".

What you did say was "Last I read", which would be fine - it's even close to, but not exactly "apparently"; except that you then use that "fact" as a jumping-off point to say "we know".

"We know" is exactly equivalent to "definitely".

He must have included hate America year. ;)

Free College for Everyone!
 

UPK, K, and 1-12. Full day UPK or Pre-K is being put in place in NYS, fully funded by the state but, for now, optional. The job I left was in an integrated UPK, unfortunately common core addresses Pre-Kindergarten so the needs of children with disabilities are ignored for the common good. One size fits all!

Wonderful, put those kids under government control as soon as possible, so we can get them bitches back to work in the sweatshops.

What could go wrong with a gov't raised child?

Attachment 50084

Might stop 9 and 10 year old girls from trying to kill their teacher.

Need we discuss your contempt for honesty by lying about Saddam's WMDs? And doing so for hundreds of posts. Honesty from knowledge was not your strong suite. You continued even after George Jr admitted those WMDs were fictional.

And still nobody attacked you, like a child, for advocating a massacre of 5000 American servicemen. A most contemptable act. And still adults did not direct cheapshots at you when you most deserved them. Please learn from history.

It's just not becoming of you. Posting cheapshot is not what adults do. If a fact is in errror, or in this case posted to promote an update, then an adult corrects the fact. Posting emotions is wasted bandwidth in threads only for adults.

Hopefully you will recall that you once acted adult. And how others reacted when you advocated Mission Accomplished, Abu Ghraid, and other extremists evils. Nobody cheapshotted you when you most deserved it. Because that is what adults do.

If you find a fact in error or in need of updating, then just contribute in a positive manner. Disparaging comments are not what UT once would do.

Accurate was the post: What justified so much emotion?

And we're done. That's our annual interaction. See you in 2016.

Not sure about the US context, but in the UK when we refer to 'free' healthcare, what is actually meant is: free at the point of need. It does not mean 'free' of cost in absolute terms. Someone has to pay for it - whether that is directly, or through taxation, or national insurance.

I suspect that the same meaning should be attached to the use of the word free in America when discussing healthcare, education etc. Nobody is suggesting that the cost of education will disappear - just that the person accessing education will not have to pay for it directly.

That is exactly what the picture in my post said.

Hence the last panel of the HUMORous post I made (attempted):

I do not think it means what you think means.

:eyebrow:

how about a free collage instead?
 

I did not realise you made the cartoon :P It's pretty good. That said - it plays on the usual argument against those who agitate for 'free' healthcare/college/birth control etc. That it is not really free. My point is that the people who agitate for 'free' healthcare etc. know this and are assuming that everyone else will understand that 'free' means 'free at the point of need', not 'free of all cost'.

We've had this conversation before Grav - what you posted is political humour - I am making a point about the political angle of that humour.

Or would you prefer I bite my tongue and say nothing when you post stuff, that I would respond to were anybody else to post it?

First thing my grandma would ask, "Who's paying for it."

50% of public education in America was paid for by the states. But then we started going to war for no useful purpose. So a Federal government no longer had money due to massive debts to pay for those wars. Therefore money to the states diminished. Then states stopped contributing to local education.

In order to pay for war, locals now pay increased property taxes and school taxes. Money has to come from somewhere. Rather than address the problem, some extremists wanto to cut costs of things that actually advance America. States and Federal spending on major bridges, highways, and tunnels virtually stopped. We no longer see a new major bridge or tunnel every decade such as in NYC (ie Washington Bridge, Verazano Bridge, etc).

So, in a nation that is wasting treasure for the greater glory of military egos, what happens to money that pays for things that makes America greater? What will pay for this education that is essential for America's innovations in 20 and 40 years from now? Who will pay for it?

You even having a grandma short curcuits my ability to reason. I had always assumed you sprang, full grown, from the Internet's troll repository. Trying to envision a child tw reduces my brain to a single, misfiring synapse. Bzzzt. Fzzzzz. Pop.

Nothing but net hilarious.

You made my day.