Who uses maps anymore?
 

I took 4 of my grandkids to Galveston again this week and on the way home my 12 year old granddaughter was sitting in the front passenger seat talking to me. The other 3 had fallen asleep from all the fun and fresh air. Kirstyn got bored and asked if she could clean and organize the glove box. I said that was fine and she started pulling out stuff and asking me if she should save it or not. I told her the owner's manual, insurance and inspection papers and any car repair receipts should be saved. She pulled out a map and asked what it was. "It's a road map" I said, "looks like Lousiana." She pulled out another, it was a map of North Carolina and then she found one for Texas. "What are they?" she asked again. "MAPS!" I said, "like for when you get off the main road and want to know where to go to get home or where you were headed."

"Why wouldn't you just use your phone?" was her response. I chuckled to myself and almost didn't offer an answer. I figured it had been a few years since I had even looked at those maps, most were pretty dog eared and worn. "Well, if you were in an area with bad cell service you couldn't use the phone." To which she replied, "what about your GPS? Doesn't it work off of satellites?"I had no answer. I think next time I wash and vacuum the car I will just pitch those maps. They were probably the free ones they used to give out at the state line welcome stations. :tinfoil:

So, do any Cellar dwellers still use old fashioned paper road maps?

Here in Oregon, and I suppose most other "western" states,
there are warnings in the winter about going off of main highways
with only "electronic" maps...battery failure, incorrect information,
loss of internet signal, etc.

Each year there are news reports of people getting lost
who relied on, or could not properly read, cellar/gps maps.
... sometimes with very bad consequences.

My G-son does a fair amount of "off-road" travel,
and topological maps and compass are routine equipment for him.

Yes for roads like that I would also use them. I still have some really good state atlas books that show every kind of rural road, even dirt roads and I do use them if I am out searching for interesting things to photograph or unique angles on things like mountains or valleys. I just realized that I haven't used a regular highway map in ages. Both of out cars have a GPS that is pretty up to date.

Not road maps, but topographical ones. I like those big state atlas/gazetteer-type that DeLorme puts out for each state.

Attachment 52580

They're usually right around $20, Popdigr stole this one for $1.99.

They definitely will not fit in the glove box.

Yes, those are the ones I meant for when I go on the back roads to travel or take pictures. I have one for Texas and New Mexico and maybe California. Although I have noticed that my TomTom GPS is pretty good if the roads have been there for a while but not for unpaved roads.

When I first started driving, I used those spiral-bound book maps that covered one city each. But with all the construction and growth, they would get unusably out-of-date within just two or three years. I think I threw out my last one no later than 2005.

We have them in Houston, they are called Key Maps. It seems like most GPS devices can get updates, sometimes you pay of they are free. I even take my GPS when we travel, I have maps for the UK, South Africa and Australia.

ME! All the time. And the kids occasionally. There's one of the city and one of the state in the glovebox and our 17yo knows how to use them if she gets lost

One thing I miss from the UK is the A-Z. Everyone had one (who drove). Invaluable. Close-up street map of a city in book form. Yes, I did just call it the A to Zee in my head. Which I have never done IRL as I haven't had/used one for many years. I was just going to bet that it was another thing that disappeared..... but Amazon UK still sells them. And downloadable versions.

When I travel, I do an area map reconnaissance beforehand out of force of habit. I want to know primary, alternate and contingency routes of ingress and egress in case I run across spontaneous short term natural or human obstacles that I'd rather avoid which won't show on my GPS. My recollection doesn't have to be detailed, just general directions and landmarks.

I like having a paper "hard copy" to back up digital displays and to replace them altogether when they don't make the weight cut. But then I'm trained and experienced in advanced land navigation using the MGRS and the UTM system as well as orienteering. Even sans Cartesian or geodetic coordinates and topographic contour lines, a basic road map still works for me.

We use paper maps and also the phone. Paper maps have far more information available at a glance. That's both a blessing and a curse.

At one time I had maps galore, loved perusing places I hadn't been. Included were USGS 7.5 degree topo maps of everything within 75 miles. I had almost a complete set of official state bicentennial maps from 1976. Now I usually check Google maps before going someplace new, then TomTom on the way.

I was surprised when some people in the southwest told me they update their GPS religiously, because of new construction. In the northeast the only new roads are housing developments, they stopped building main roads years ago

Google Maps has routed me around hours of traffic delays.

It now tells you how much shorter or longer your trip will be if you take the next exit.

It tells you if an accident happens on your intended route and plans how to get around it

When I left for the theater yesterday, 35 minutes away, it told me I would arrive at 7:12pm and I did

It has its annoyances but one thing I do like is how new features and improvements just suddenly appear

Waze

Yeah, as much as I rely on Garmin, paper maps are better for exploring an area.

This.
Plus - downloadable A-Zs!????!! I must check that out!

Sent by thought transference

I like paper maps and paper books. Even more as my irritation with computers and their ilk grows by the minute.

I bet we have ten pounds of paper maps of Land Between The Lakes Nat'l Recreation Area, from various sizes and iterations over the years.

MyTOPO is a great internet resource. You can view/buy all kinds of different versions of maps. Pocket size, very small area. Huge poster-size of the same very small area...Or as big an area as you want. Waterproof/not waterproof/creaseproof/pre-folded. If you're a tiny bit underhanded, you can download those customized maps, from the preview page.;)

Good tip.

yebbut, it changes its estimated ETA as you drive so as you get closer to your destination, it gets more accurate. Or was that the estimate when you left home? I take that as a challenge :D

Paper maps? I use them still. When ElderSon was moving from Seattle to Denver, we met as he was on his way out of town. Like most youngsters, he was quite willing to meet, since it included a free meal. And a meal for his truck, gas, oil, etc. And I asked him about his map situation... he whipped out his iPhone and I facepalmed. No. just... no. Hell no. What if you sit on it an crack it. The battery dies? No signal, etc. etc. etc. etc.

Etc.

Aaaanyhow, he got all his travel victuals AND a Rand McNally Road Atlas for the region, Western US I think. FFS, he's a Boy Scout, you know how to read a map, right? He did and does, but the *value* of a map with its vastly smaller pool of possible points of failure compared to phone based navigation was completely lost on him.

I haven't checked in with him on this topic lately, but I'll ask him the next time I see him.

As for me, I love maps, I collect them, I use them, I navigate by them, I remember places by them, and I dream of places I haven't been to *yet* by them. Yes, maps, please.

http://www.motherjones.com/files/blog_fuck_shit_map.jpg

MOAR BAD WORD MAPS

I'm with V on this one. I don't trust my phone. It does weird things too often.
I'd rather have a (GOOD) paper map any day; as in not one of those ones drawn on location flyers by people who have missed out half the roads. Some of us are counting them as we walk past you know.

And I'm actually a competent map-reader when I'm well.
Road maps. Not great with open land and a compass.

Then again I don't drive. Sat-nav wasn't in the sort of car I could afford, so I'd never used it in my life.

ETA - LJ's post is the only shit-map I approve of.

I don't think I could live in a blue state.

Man, if I had spent all the time I spent doing that, actually doing something, I might have made something of myself.

if my study/office/lair/whatever was ever tidy and clean, one might find a map-based decorative theme :) You can certainly see the three or four globes on top of all the stuff. Hoarder, me? Nooooooooo

You just made me remember I have a poster-size world map still on my bedroom wall from when I was into shortwave radio.

were all the countries discovered then?

Yep. Some of them have had their name changed...:rolleyes:

Funny... My son loved maps. When he was around 5yo, we used to hide things around the neighborhood, draw treasure maps and later go and find them. It was more for fun then anything, didn't really go as far as triangulating exact positions but getting the general idea of landmarks and how to use them to spot yourself. It didn't cross my mind that he was learning an outdated skill.
I wonder how much truth is there in the idea that these things can be justified by indirectly training cognitive capacities and introducing basic conceptual building blocks, even when the skills themselves rarely if ever go to good use (A.K.A. The same justification as calculus or handwriting).

Hang on - handwriting does not "rarely if ever go to good use". Does it?
Maybe it's because I don't own a printer, but if I couldn't use a pen I'd be completely stuffed.

I use it myself, out of habit, mostly because it feels better to write thoughts on paper, and it's easier to use the space on the page freely for that as well. Outside of those though, I can't remember the last time I've seen anything handwritten that wasn't small enough to fit on a sticky note.. And personally I have abandoned sticky notes for virtual ones, makes it easier to copy and paste stuff into more organized formats like todolists or calendar items.
This could just be my own experience though - I also prefer doing math in my head or on paper, but I'v'e seen people take out an app for calculating tips in restaurants...

You are right though, it is subjective. I am sure there are much better examples of skills that are no longer in common use but might still have value for child development... Somehow their escaping me atm.

edit; Ooh.. Does remembering things on your own count?

In truth, I probably write more than most people my age. I keep up a handwritten correspondence with people just for fun. And sometimes because I know how much more special it is to see an envelope on your doormat and know who it's from, rather than seeing it in your inbox. Case in point, my Mum's friend going through radiation treatment at present. I've sent her a card or a postcard every week, as I know she's low physically and emotionally, and can't make it out of the house some days. And yet she is internet savvy.

Maybe I just don't trust technology (or even electricity!) enough.
I have a hard-backed notebook with some important phone numbers and addresses in. I use it to write down appointments, shopping lists, workings out of what I need to pay and how much I'll have to pay it with, remind me of birthdays, things to tell Mum, questions to ask my support worker etc etc. I'm more likely to have it with me than I am my keys :facepalm:

I bashed up my phone the other week. It still works. But I worry that one day it will get grumpy about sharing my bag with various birdseed, books and bubbles and pack up completely. When I say back-up, I mean paper, baby.

The map is often only seen as an aid to getting from A to B, but it is more than that. It enables you to see, at a glance where you stand in the great geographical scheme of things.
Whether it is a world atlas, or a large scale local map it assists orientation and general awareness.
If I want to drive from A to B I can look at a map, see which towns I will pass or go through, how I can avoid congestion by bypassing places, see if hilly terrain with narrow roads can be avoided and a host of other information is there to provide an all round assessment of the journey.

Now, my experience of using car satnav is limited to say the least but, unless things have improved in the last few years, the A to B satnav assisted journey is a somewhat limited affair.
It's akin to being pushed about with an electric cattle prod until you get to your destination. Plug in two post codes and fill in the bit in the middle by obeying the orders.

Perhaps that’s all people want. Delegate the decision making and the tiresome business of thinking for yourself and consider it money well spent.

I do agree with you Carrutherstown in that a satnav gives you tunnel vision about your route and lacks all of the peripheral information which makes many a journey pleasurable but it also has its uses especially when feed with real time traffic information.
Our satnav gave us an interesting route from York to High Wycombe the other day almost totally excluding the M1 which was chock a block. It started in the A1 and then led us to lengthy tracts of the A46 to the M40. If never gave thought of that route and it was largely trouble free ...

Sent by thought transference

The greatest things about trips are the side trips. You know, you're driving down that A46, and there's the sign for Her Majesty's Royal Cactus Museum. Or, Snake Exhibit. Or, Madame Knowitall, Palm Reading Snake Dancer. Or, whatever.

I love the spontaneous side trip.

I have a degree in geography, I love paper maps.

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Exactly...

Back when, I used to say that everyone should have to drive across the entire US, at least once.
Some of the best memories were the unexpected and unplanned sights, people, and places.

Back then, commercial flying was very customer-oriented
with various perks: comfortable seats, special meals, etc.
But even then there was so much lost in a 4-hr trip across the US.
And just look how much better things are now !

I can't believe there's much fun during the 45 minutes in the Chunnel.
... I'm sure it's because there's no chance for a spontaneous side-trip. :rolleyes:

I don’t have a degree in geography, but I do love paper maps.

A quick audit of same revealed the following:

2 x UK Road Atlases

4 x US Atlases of various scales and focus.

3 x USGS large scale maps of SE Wyoming

1 x World Atlas

12 (approx) x 1:25000 and 1:50000 local or semi-local maps. (Ordnance Survey)

1 x Photographic Atlas of England. Full aerial survey coverage of the country at the millenium.

1 x UK air navigation chart (VFR)

2 x UK air navigation charts (IFR)

There's probably some more somewhere!


Unique selling point of a paper map? The batteries never run down. ;)

I almost played devil's advocate for minute to point out that paper maps do not speak.

They do speak, volumes, in fact, just not out loud.

:)

Just got back from week's vacation in the National Forest. Had GPS. And a paper map. Latter was much more useful/used

There's a joke in their somewhere about having to go to the bathroom and not having any TP or big leaves around.

Huge fan of maps. I came of age in the military when we had acetate overlays and grease pencils. lol.

I saw a Tomtom street view camera car rolling through my neighborhood today. Didn't know Tomtom was collecting the info.

On our recent vacation in rural western Michigan, we had one incident where the GPS tried to guide us to our campsite down a tiny track you could maybe have got a Jeep down.

There were several instances where we would come to a four way junction on the GPS and there would be only 3 or 2 visible roads, the other direction was just a field.

Once we stopped trusting it entirely and used map in parallel it was OK

Such an experience gives meaning to "Caveat Emptor"

For most people it's an inconvenience. But the news has way too many stories of people who follow their GPS instructions without thinking, ending up in lakes, rivers, subway tunnels, or on railroad tracks. :facepalm:

I heard an interview with one of the Park Rangers from Death Valley, they rescue 6 or so people in acute ditsress each year, who have been guided up old mining trails that are marked on the map, and run out of gas.
Deaths are not uncommon either.

Unfortunately, many people seem to surrender their powers of independent thought and accept what the electronic gizmo tells them to do, to the point of ignoring the evidence of their own eyes.

Locally there is a narrow lane with a couple of houses and a farm entrance. This lane peters out into a rough track and connects the first farm with another on the same estate.

On a number of occasions cars have ventured up there because the satnav told their drivers to do so, despite it being obvious to those with eyes to see, that it is totally unsuited to anything but tractors and agricultural 4 x 4 vehicles.

A few weeks ago I was out with my canine guest at the point where the track becomes unsuitable for cars, when I saw a Saab approaching.

The driver stopped and asked me if he was heading in the right direction for the other farm, but I gently advised him to take the alternative route via the main road if he didn't want to lose his sump.

Quite why this track is shown in satnav systems isn't clear, but no doubt somebody will try again very soon.

The surface is chalk and perilous in wet weather which tends to offer a character forming driving experience.

Brit ~ I say chap, this lane is quite unsuitable for your Saab, Likely to lose your sump, you see. It would be wiser to take the paved way round.http://cellar.org/2015/shades.gif

American ~ What are you a fucking moron? Get the fuck outta here, asshole!http://cellar.org/2015/willy_nilly.gif

The thing about GPSs is that if it does give you a bad route, just skip the turn and keep going until it stops telling you to make a U-turn.

That's easy to believe considering so many people get lost on clearly marked, safe to traverse, paved streets. :haha:

There's no guarantee that this chap would have fared any better if he'd used a map, but a certain scepticism towards his satnav instructions might have helped.

I realise that it's easy to point fingers from the comfort of my chair, but take a look at the blue sign on the pub wall.

http://s11.postimg.org/v03w4tx2b/Unsuitable.jpg

There will have been a corresponding sign at the other end of the lane but he let the satnav take precedence over what he could see for himself.
I post this not to ridicule the poor chap, but out of puzzlement as to why he let it happen.

BBC

Daily Mail There's a good selection of photos, even if the text is somewhat over excited.

Street View

I love the idea that the satnav took the lorry (with the presumably trapped driver) there. He was obviously just along for the ride.

Might want to change that data set before the super safe self driving trucks hit the road.

Apologies. Made a mess of the Street View link in post #54.

Street View.

Working now!

Sat/Nav is a great help, but like everything else to come along, it's not a fix for stupid.
Sometimes it's little confusing, so I'll just sit in the middle of the fucking intersection while I figure it out. :mad2:

One year, my mom came down with her Garmin to use so we could go to the beach. I didn't print out instructions and there was no smart phone. The Garmin was never charged so we couldn't use it. I had instructions, but I got lost before we even got out of my county. We kept driving hoping to hit a highway we needed. Nope. We stopped and got a paper map and used it to get us where we needed to be. I think it's a useful skill because technology can, and does, fail.

I used my city map at least twice this weekend to navigate a tricky neighborhood and a route from A to B through a tricky neighborhood/riverside area that is avoided by electronic route planners but cuts the time between A and B at least in half and has pretty scenery to boot.