The Rules of the Game
 

Given the healthy ration of hack philosophy flying around the net these days, I thought it might be a good idea to review the rules of the game.

We may not agree on the outcome, but the level of debate would rise dramatically if people would spend at least a moment reviewing how to avoid bad arguments, and how to support good ones.

-sm

Party pooper. ;)

see, now I can call that an ad hominem attack and everyone will know the actual meaning of the phrase! how helpful is that!

-sm

i don't understand. isn't ad hominem a word that means the same thing as another word?

That's homonym.

Ad hominem

oops - didn't see your wink.

an ad homonym attack would rather amusing indeed.

Most of this stuff is just basic logic, that said, it'd still be worth some people reading ;)

My usual arguing technique is reductio ad absurdum. I seem to recall getting accused of putting words into people's mouths more than once with that one ;P

i'm not sure if i should be insulted or not that you, even for an instant, thought i was that stupid...

and i think it is really a synonym.

homonym is when they sound the same, synonym is when they mean the same.

yep, uh-huh, what he said. it is so hard sometimes to read a post and decide whether it was typed with sarcasm or not.

also, everyone should probably read this as a contrary example.

-sm

sorry, couldn't help it.

Which is why god invented smilies. :3eye:

are we back to referring to UT as god, again? why didn't anyone send me the *$@*ing memo?!?!?!

Did you fill out form PT29X3 in triplicate? Was it filed at City Hall in the room in the basement with the large sign on the door that says "No admittance" - the one with the jaguar guarding the door?

If you want to be on the memo list, you must follow proper procedure.

i thought that room was only for the Giants . how long do i have to dwell as a commoner inthe cellar before i can gain admittance?

I assume that question is rhetorical. If not, the answer is 42.

Your mediclorian count isn't high enough, your chi lacks wang and your feng shui is out of wack.

if i promise to only post once a month, may gain admittance?


yes - i'm trying to bait HB back out into the open. sooner or later, he'll have to quit lurking as a guest.

That's sposeda be automatic with Version 3.0.2...

God made 'em, UT stole 'em. ;)

Hmmm...Ann Coulter? :rolleyes:

one thing that bugs me is when you disagree with a person, and they just keep repeating themselves, or coming up with different analogies for the same damn point. what's that called?

radar

It's called the, if-you-really-understood-what-I'm-saying,-you-couldn't-possibly-not-agree,-so-I'll-rephrase-it-hopping-it'll-get-through-your-thick-skull, method. :)

if you haven't been there already, you really, really should go to www.protestwarrior.com and watch some of the videos. I know they go intentionally out of their way to find the dumbest supporters of the opposing position, but still, it's like a clinic in logic gone way, way wrong. Hilarious.

-sm

there was some pretty funny stuff in there SM, thanks.

So do we all agree on the premise of The Rules before we can start making valid arguments? If you accept these rules then any detraction will invalidate your argument, or is that a non-sequitur?

Well I guess we can use it as a de facto system but ceteris paribus it will soon be ignored. Prima facie this kind of thing is good idea but the in heat of a debate it'll just lead into endless tangents about the vailidy of arguments, leading to no real improvment per se.

Pace jag, that is ipso facto a fortiori a complete simpliciter. ;)

see? and now we all speak latin!

how much do I rock?

-sm

you rocka very mucho :)


oh, sorry, latin not latino :rolleyes:

There's the fallacy ad fallacium -- the fallacious idea that if an proposition is supported by fallacious arguments, it must be false. Then there's logical fallacies that work pretty well in real life, such as the old standby ad hominem (if an asshole supports the idea it must be stupid) and some forms of the slippery slope (if you give them an inch they'll take a mile). Also the fallacy ad fellatium, which has something to do with Bill Clinton.

Don't forget the fallacy ad rectum.

Someone who is cleary talking out of their ass.

ad obfuscarum

the fallacy of burying your argument in obscure vocabulary, so that people are too intimidated to respond …

-sm

But that's half of the fun sometimes.

Indubitably. Byzantine patois is in perpetuum salutary to circumlocute behind.

Obfuscating your quodlibet via magniloquent language peppering one's causeries is poor form I agree.

fuck yeah! :cool: looks like us colonists aren't too good at that stuff, huh?

Or just write you off as a loser and move on. :)

Life's too short for rules. ;)

Rules give life value and meaning.

Rules let us learn from other than our own experiences.

So does simply living life. That's not to say that we don't "need" rules, b/c we certainly do, but IMO, for some things, just go with the flow sometimes. Can't hurt, can it?
:D

Rules are left-brain, alphabetic, law-oriented, linear and patriarchal. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Too few rules is as bad as too many rules in my opinion.

I've spent a long time figuring out which rules are important and which ones aren't, both in regards to myself and to others.

You're not actually that obtuse are you?

Do tell? Yes--I am that obtuse. Just ask xoxoxoBruce. He'll vouch for me.

Don't mind me TS--I am just reading THE ALPHABET VERSUS THE GODDESS and feeling right-brained, iconic, cyclical, and matriarchal right at the mo.

What the sense of having rules if you just pick and choose which ones you want to go with and which ones you discard? Shouldn't, in that case, they be called suggestions?

Brianna? Obtuse? Probably pig-headed is more apropos, but obtuse works. ;)

I'm trying to read that right now too. I keep falling asleep though. http://www.cellar.org/images/smilies/redface.gif

That is sooooo cool! I feel smarter already! Just take it in teeny-tiny doses--I usually chop the chapters up into 1/3 or 1/4 if real intense...coool!! :ivy:

TS is a Capricorn. He can't help but need rules and regs, and can't help but think he's always right on everything....it's not his fault. It's society's fault....don't condemn him 'cause he's inflexible.

:haha:

Sidhe

The idea is to take the time and figure out which ones work best and which ones are dross. Ideas should evolve so that they can retain their applicability. There should be room for change in the rules because situations change.

I'm not just going down the list and picking and choosing. I'm searching for a core of ideas that are valid across a spectrum of situations but resilient enough to stand the test of time. A solid core with fuzzy logic buffer if you will.

Hah hah hah... :meanface:

I'm not inflexible, I'm stalwart, yeah stalwart, and forthright, and stuff like that.

And I am always right. :stickpoke

That's what everyone lets you think cause we don't want to bruise your fragile ego. We figure, let the old man have his moment in the spotlight, what can it hurt, ya know?
:grouphug:

Sidhe