Isolationism
 

What do you think about the proposed wall separating Mexico and the States?

What do you think about the Berlin wall?

What do you think about wall separating the Palestinians from Israel?

What do you think about Bush’s bullshit about "false comfort of isolationism"?

What do you think of the fact that Canadians can tip-toe across the States border at will, and easily impersonate Americans by wearing jeans which show the top of our ass crack when we bend over?

I missed the address. I would have enjoyed bush giving us his unique interpretation when he attempted to say the word isolationism.

Mexican Wall = Bad
Berlin Wall = Bad
Israel Wall = Good

I didn't watch the speech. Life is too short to spend watching stuff like that. I updated the contents of my iPod instead, and bought a set of earphones off e-bay.

Walls are not neighborly or friendly. I would prefer a world where walls were not needed. A wall to keep people in against their will (like the Berlin wall) is far worse than a wall to keep people out (like the Israeli wall and the US southern border wall.) I think I understand the rational for both the US and Israeli walls, but don't care for either.

Thoughtful posts, ty.

Love to hear from anybody who heard how he handled the word, “isolationism”.

A classic example of those who think using a head between their legs verses those who use a head between their shoulders. Ask yourself why those walls exist? Would it not be smarter to eliminate reasons for those walls? History demonstrates walls - ie demilitarized zone between North and South Vietnam - do not work. With divisions of troops, electronic surveillence, air attacks, etc - still that wall did not work.

Those who think with a head between their legs never bother to look beyond what they see AND never ask why. It is the difference between a strategic thinker verses one who follows propaganda. Remember, there was no bombings, terrorism, and a need for that wall in Israel before 2000. What changed?

How many walls were failures. The 30 foot wall between Egypt and Israel never stopped anything. The Great Wall of China was a proven failure - but they kept building it anyway. The wall between Syria and Iraq does nothing even though militaries on both sides reinforce that wall. US Mexican border wall is based upon same knee jerk thinking. Notice how those who advocate the wall never bother to first learn why problems exists. The difference between a leader with intelligence verses a blind follower of Rush Limbaugh. Rush Limbaugh followers only know what they see - nothing more. They routinely and repeatedly don't ask why - such as the question I ask here. Those who bother to learn that which makes intelligence, then, would ask why that wall is suddenly necessary.

I have posted reasons why, often and previously. So you tell me. Why is each wall necessary?

I never said that I supported building any of the walls in the example. I was simply saying that I understand the desire to build the the Mexico and Palestine walls.

To answer your question, the reasons for walls are pretty simple. It's to keep undesirable people out.

Of course, you already knew that. You want me to defend these walls as the best way to prevent terrorism in Israel and prevent illegal immigrants from flooding into the US. I'm not convinced they are the best way, so I won't be arguing that point with you.

Good. Why are those people undesireable and why must they be kept out? You still have not answered the question. Of course I did not know that ... since I posted example after example where walls failed to address a problem when leaders used 'sound byte' reasoning. But show me. Show me the problem solved by a US Mexico wall (or did you forget lessons in the movie 'Traffic'?). Show me why an Israeli West Bank wall solves what creates that problem? To advocate walls, one must first explain why the problem exists. What is this 'simple' reason that suddenly makes walls necessary. To keep undersireable people out does not even begin to say why the problem exists or what the problem really is. Why are these people undesireable?

Why do people want to ban gay marriage? Because they are uncomfortable with gays. But banning gay marriage won't solve their problem. Just because A is a reason for B doesn't mean that B will help A. In this case, the wall is a symptom of the problem, not a solution.

Fine. But still - what is the problem? In another thread, Democrats are accurately defines as (essentially) bankrupt of good ideas. Here is but another example of a Democratic Party avoiding what should be a national question - not just a Cellar question. What is the problem that has created this 'knee-jerk need' for walls?

Nope, the wall in Israel is to keep the Jews in one place so we can kill off 13 million to force the second coming. Don't you know anything? :lol:

What are you getting at, tw?

You know why Israel wants to keep the Palestinians out. It's because a small subset of their numbers are trying to blow the Israelis up.

You also know that the US has a love/hate relationship with illegal immigrants. While they do provide cheap labor, they are a burden on our society without paying into it.

Is your question "why now?" Or is it simply "why?"

I don't know why it's a big problem now. Probably because since 9/11 a lot of people are afraid. Even though the terrorists came in through Canada, the Mexicans are easier to be afraid of. They don't speak English and they look different.

Why did Arab Israeli terrorism stop *completely* in the late 1990s? What changed that created 2000+ terrorism? There was no need for walls in the late 1990s. What changed?

Assumption that illegal immigraton causes undo stress on American resources has long been proven wrong. It can cause isolated problem where, for example, the most productive source of America's future - immigrants legal and illegal - require education and other investments in America's future. But long term, illegal immigation has been beneficial to the United States. Meanwhile why does this illegal immigration exist? Also why was it not a major problem decades ago? What changed?

What changed that caused this need for a wall? I keep asking this question. Not one response has yet to even approach an answer. Every answer goes to some propaganda idea that 'they are not wanted', or that they are illegal and therefore must be bad. Ok. Why?

Why did the Demilitarized Zone wall in Vietnam fail so catastrophically? Go right back to same principles that are not being addressed here. What is this problem that a wall is suppose to solve? I read popular myths. But I have yet to read a concrete fact. What exactly is the reason for this problem?

Well according to administration policies over the past five years, we have all but encouraged Iran to finish each other off with nuclear weapons. The funniest part is that this conclusion is half humorous and half true.

Well, TW, in the world according to DOV, it's the agenda. :rolleyes:

My vanity thanks you.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...eisraelusa.jpg

Your turn.

I did not watch the speech either as I can't stomach politicians in general. However I do support strong borders and both the Mexican and Canadian borders are unacceptably open in my opinion. There are too many people in this world that want all of us dead for the simple fact that we don't align with their god or that we have something they want or resent. There is no way to change this ... you change our policies to please one group and you alienate a different group.

I fully support isolationism at this point. Turn off all the foreign aid taps and take care of our own and do our best to protect the people in this country. This would make those countries that don't want us there happy and piss off those that do want us there (again, make one set happy, piss off an other)

Its ok, go ahead and isolate. China is waiting in the wings and it would be their pleasure in replacing you for our two-way trade in goods and services between Canada and the U.S. which was in 2004 worth over US$441 billion. (China has better credit, net 30)


isolate

isolate

Canada has larger oil reserves than Saudi Arabia.

Please build a wall along our border of 5,526 miles of land, which separates us.

As long as it keeps you out of my country and from invading us and stealing our oil.

Would you consider for a moment that it's possible your paranoia is getting the better of you dov?

My paranoia is my best friend. Its kept me alive this long and loves partying with me.

I had a friend like that once. Not all friends are good friends. Not all friends are good for the soul or the body.

Incidently, Australia has to be one of the most isolated countries in the world but that hasn't stopped us from having issues with illegal imigrants or terrorism or any of the other things discussed on this thread due to shared borders.

'due to' probably should have been; being attributed to.

Trust me, you and Canada have nothing I want.

Tell me that when you run out of gas.

We are your number one oil supplier and there is a rumour the Saudi reserves are eighty percent depleted.

Your plan to rip off Iraqi’s oil fucked up.

China has signed with both Mexico and Venezuela, for oil, (and us).

I recommend you learn how to ride a horse to work.

We may talk about water another time.

you are one deluded and confused individual ... good luck with that.

I am one hundred percent correct.

I could shove a thousand references that Canada is America’s leading supplier of imported oil, natural gas, uranium, and electricity, up your nose and you wouldn’t smell a thing. You would most definitely reply with something insightful and witty such as, you are one deluded and confused individual.

Here is a reference, I have one hundred more, but you have proven to me that even the time I am spending presently showing you facts, is useless. I have seen you on every Board I have ever visited, your predictable and a dime a dozen.

If Canada gave a shit, we may supply you with the mortar for your wall, but we do not, so find your own mortar.

American Freemasons are drooling

All your base belong to US. :p

What language is that?

Your confusion is understandable. Bruce was close, but he overlooked some simple grammar. It's "All your base are belong to US."

Why are any of us bothering to reply to this person? They post a question then jump on any one who doesn't agree with their point of view. So you think Canada is a great super power ... as I said before, "good luck with that". If we had any chance that Canada could actually safe guard it's own border, then we wouldn't need a border between us ... but you can't!

And you can reply with whatever inane or insane comment (that I know you will, go head, prove me right) as I will not be returning to this thread nor to any thread you start again ...

I didn't mean to scare you away.

"All your base are belong to US." Is that some type of code?

We have no reason to isolate. We are not worried that terrorists will enter Canada through the States. We do not need a wall. We are a peace loving country, and the world knows we will always be anywhere needed in the name of peace. Occasionally we go after the bad guys.

BTW, you need us, we do not need you. You are our only liability.


They will also be looking for OBL, remember OBL? OBL who was responsible for 9/11, contrary to the popular belief that Saddam was responsible.

Well, we are holding Mike Meyers hostage... And I'd say Celine Dion is a second liability of yours.

What dov's really trying to say...

Your map could use some fixin. You left off the umbilical cord connecting Quebec to France.

As much as I wish I could, I can’t argue this fact, sigh.

Who here boycotted French’s Mustard?
http://www.hollywoodframegallery.com/koehn/french.jpg

Yes.

Well, not actually. It is an inside joke and you are outdoors.

Sorry for skipping ahead before reading all the other posts, it is doubtful that I'd remember this initial thought by the time I got to the end.

Well, for starters we have to pay them a shit load more money in the states than we do if they are kept at home. Doesn't letting them into the US defeat the point of nafta? How are US corporations going to enjoy the benefits of remote slavery if the slaves insist on moving closer to our home? jeez louise.

And dov, speaking of ass cracks, my first reaction to the wall was how about a wall between my asshole and the current administration? I'm sure I'm not the only american who could get behind that, so to speak.

BTW, we'd suss out you canucks the moment you said eh? at the end of a sentence ass crack or not.

now I'll go ahead and read the rest of the replies

And while you're at it, take off every zig.

For great justice!!!

Bingo. So why do we subsidize so many corporations to keep those jobs in America - that then require illegal immigrants? Why does the US government subsidize 50% of all sugar especially for the benefit of US Sugar and others on corporate welfare. From The Economist of 25 April 2005: Furthemore, US government subsidizes make it virtually impossible to grow sugar in nations where sugar is better grown. US literally dumps excess sugar on world markets thereby destroying jobs in those other nations.

This is why the Doha Round broke up three days early in Cancun when anti-free trade nations - US and France - refused to even negotiate. Trade of goods WE make in American by restricting free trade and by subsidizing with corporate welfare.

We massively subsidize corn that is better grown overseas. OK. Now that agricultural industry needs employees. But we put restriction on legal immigration by requiring things like advance degrees. Where are those labors to come from? From the countries who need those jobs and could better grow that corn if free trade was practiced.

Now we will solve a problem that WE created by putting up walls? When does intelligence get used instead of bricks? In other venues, that same condition is called a riot - what happens when people use force rather than intellect to solve a problem.

They would rather stay home and work. But there is no work at home. US agricultural subsidies alone literally bankrupt third world agricultural industries. Sugar is only one in a long list of problems created by Americans who are 'on the take' and by other Americans who ignore this political corruption called corporate welfare.

You think a wall is a solution? Well how much do you ready know about the WTO Cancun conference where enemies of free trade were the United States and France?

Somebody set up us the bomb!

(damn, that works for both the real thread and the drift, doesn't it?)

I doubt we need foreign workers for the corn, wheat, sorgum, millet, sunflower or rice farms. These are highly mechanized and automated requiring very little labor.
The armies of cheap labor are needed for fruit and vegetable crops where hand labor is intensive and backbreaking. :thepain3:

tw, you have a lot of good points thst I'd like to reply to, but I just got back from the hospital after cutting part of my finger off, so limited typing.

the wall is just rearranging deck chair on the titanic. its' just a cluster fuck and I'm sure the job will go to one of bush pals.

gotta go now

Us the bomb is set up!

thank you for making it clear that you still don't get it.

Which letters will be missing in future posts?

qwerty
asdfgh
zxcvbn

will appear randomly and in no predictablr oderr order

Shouldn't that be:

2
w
s
x

and their shifted counterparts?

Edit:

I noted after posting that the subset listed above would make the word sexwax particularly difficult for you to type. As a courtesy, I intended to include a link for you. I was pleasantly surprised to find two good ones. Enjoy.

SexWax, what it really is...


Sexwax, what you wanted it to be. ;)

A pal of mine has this saw. it is a no brainer.

now wehn they make a jointer stop...
;)

Does this mean that footfootfoot cannot point his finger at the camera and say, "I did not have sex with that woman"? Is that a good thing? What would Bill say?

The problem with that thing is you have to take it on faith it will work when you need it.
When activated, it destroys the brake and the blade (hopefully not a Freud), so you set it up with a new blade & brake and hope it'll work again. :worried:

First off all, I can still point the finger at anyone and my caapccaity for denial is undiminshed by either the painkillers or whatever I was going to say.

Secondly, somehting else.

as for the new saw brake and blade, I've already paid for it in time lost to work. (self employed here)

as what's his name said:
you can't have everything, where would you put it?

So did you have sex with that woman? I don't care about the saw blade.

dov, you sure are a condescending fucker.

let me remind you that you are not Canada. you may be Canadian, but you're not Canada. stop trying to take credit for your percieved superiority.

cock

While quite great, that link left off perhaps the best known and most well done of that genre:

How do you define the word: "with"?

Bill!! How are you? How's Hilary?

Just need to say I have that slab of vinyl wrapped in that creamy goodness.

Bush doesn't understand the difference between isolationism and neutrality, that is to say, minding our own goddamned business.