[lumberjim]

Redux,
Does your bank tell you that they mark up the rate the Fed sells them the money for? Did you not already know it? If the rate you get is still lower than you can find, have you still been 'manipulated'? Also, it says "The Annual Percentage Rate May Be Negotiable With The Dealer" in bold type right on the face of the contract....

my main objection is the way people point to this or that practice and act like they've been wronged somehow. I'll grant that there are deceptive practices in any business (usually related to advertising), but with the level of regulation and disclosure there is today, you are usually safe at a New Car Dealer.