Wikipedia

busterb · 02-13-2007, 04:36 PM

College: Wikipedia Not Source for Papers

Feb 13, 8:21 AM (ET)

MIDDLEBURY, Vt. (AP) - Middlebury College history students are no longer allowed to use Wikipedia in preparing class papers.

The school's history department recently adopted a policy that says it's OK to consult the popular online encyclopedia, but that it can't be cited as an authoritative source by students.

The policy says, in part, "Wikipedia is not an acceptable citation, even though it may lead one to a citable source."

History professor Neil Waters says Wikipedia is an ideal place to start research but an unacceptable way to end it.

40

DanaC · 02-13-2007, 04:39 PM

Fair enough.

Flint · 02-13-2007, 05:09 PM

#1:

God forbid one has to follow a few links in order to flesh out a premise.

#2:

Quote:

Middlebury College history students are no longer allowed to use Wikipedia in preparing class papers.

I love these articles that start off with a bang, and then proceed to completely contradict themselves.

#3:

This really indicates a problem with the standard information model, doesn't it? We're stuck on training students how to do something that they don't really need to know how to do anymore, IE training chefs how to make fire by rubbing two sticks together, when we know that ovens exist.

Cloud · 02-13-2007, 05:32 PM

First, may I just say that Wikipedia rocks! I access it pretty much daily.

Second, I agree in general with the prohibition for citing them for college papers. Encylopedias are meant to be background research--a starting point. College students should be citing primary sources or scholarly secondary sources. Otherwise it's the equivalent of that paper on panda bears you did in fourth grade where you basically copied the World Book entry.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint

#This really indicates a problem with the standard information model, doesn't it? We're stuck on training students how to do something that they don't really need to know how to do anymore, IE training chefs how to make fire by rubbing two sticks together, when we know that ovens exist.

Ha! you think that's bad--try teaching (or learning) legal research the Oldskool way--with books. It's hard, because almost no one does it that way anymore, BUT--it is necessary to learn for a variety of reasons.

Pie · 02-13-2007, 05:19 PM

Ooo oooh do we need a Cellar.org entry for Wikipedia?

Undertoad · 02-13-2007, 05:20 PM

The stronger student will edit the Wikipedia entry to correct it or fill out sections that need more information.

The perfect student will create a definitive entry about a subject that previously did not exist or was only a leaf node.

Undertoad · 02-13-2007, 05:23 PM

Sadly cellar.org does not meet Wikipedia's standards as a notable topic. If we started a page for it, other people would delete it.

Flint · 02-13-2007, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Sadly cellar.org does not meet Wikipedia's standards as a notable topic.

Awww...well you guys can read this Audiogalaxy page instead. AG 4-EVER!!!1!

skysidhe · 02-16-2007, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint

Awww...well you guys can read this Audiogalaxy page instead. AG 4-EVER!!!1!

*thinking outloud*

stop bringing that gwaddamn place up.

Kitsune · 02-16-2007, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skysidhe

*thinking outloud*

stop bringing that gwaddamn place up.

He may be an AG'er "4-EVER!!!1!", but you'll notice he is, in fact, still on the Cellar and logs in almost everyday.

Once you've descended into The Cellar, you never go back up the stairs.

DanaC · 02-13-2007, 05:25 PM

Quote:

This really indicates a problem with the standard information model, doesn't it? We're stuck on training students how to do something that they don't really need to know how to do anymore,

How so? What is it that we are teaching students to do, that they no longer need to do?

DanaC · 02-13-2007, 05:33 PM

Exactly. It's a useful skill to learn.

Cloud · 02-13-2007, 05:45 PM

Er, I'm not sure what you are saying here, DanaC, since you seem to be making contradictory statements, but I'll expand. (puts down Krispy Kreme some evil soul brought to work). Now I'll expound:

1) College students (at least in the liberal disciplines) should be learning a couple of broad categories of learning: critical analysis and how to find information, i.e., research. Both of these skills are combined when doing a research paper and translate well into the workplace. Looking up an encylopedia article (print or online) and copying it does not serve either of these goals fully.

2) Legal research is especially difficult, as anyone who has tried to learn it discovers. It's mostly done online now, because the old, book-based way is EXTREMELY cumbersome. As a paralegal teacher, I have been in the unenviable position of --trying to teach it; and --justifying why.

The main reasons why a prospective law student needs to do it the old way are:
--you might get hired by a firm that only does it on paper
--your bosses likely learned the old way and will SCOFF at your ignorance
--not everything is online, even now, and likely never will be
--it's part of the basics of the profession; it's like wax on/wax off--you have to soak up the basic moves before you can kick ass

Sheldonrs · 02-13-2007, 06:44 PM

Would this be a good time to mention that I have never used Wikipedia? Never even went to the site.

King · 02-14-2007, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheldonrs

Would this be a good time to mention that I have never used Wikipedia? Never even went to the site.

You should go there now!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page

02-13-2007, 05:19 PM	#5
Pie Gone and done Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 4,808	Ooo oooh do we need a Cellar.org entry for Wikipedia? __________________ per·son \ˈpər-sən\ (noun) - an ephemeral collection of small, irrational decisions The fun thing about evolution (and science in general) is that it happens whether you believe in it or not.

02-13-2007, 05:45 PM	#13
Cloud ... Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 8,360	Er, I'm not sure what you are saying here, DanaC, since you seem to be making contradictory statements, but I'll expand. (puts down Krispy Kreme some evil soul brought to work). Now I'll expound: 1) College students (at least in the liberal disciplines) should be learning a couple of broad categories of learning: critical analysis and how to find information, i.e., research. Both of these skills are combined when doing a research paper and translate well into the workplace. Looking up an encylopedia article (print or online) and copying it does not serve either of these goals fully. 2) Legal research is especially difficult, as anyone who has tried to learn it discovers. It's mostly done online now, because the old, book-based way is EXTREMELY cumbersome. As a paralegal teacher, I have been in the unenviable position of --trying to teach it; and --justifying why. The main reasons why a prospective law student needs to do it the old way are: --you might get hired by a firm that only does it on paper --your bosses likely learned the old way and will SCOFF at your ignorance --not everything is online, even now, and likely never will be --it's part of the basics of the profession; it's like wax on/wax off--you have to soak up the basic moves before you can kick ass __________________ "Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the bastards!"

02-13-2007, 06:44 PM	#14
Sheldonrs Master Dwellar Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 4,412	Would this be a good time to mention that I have never used Wikipedia? Never even went to the site. __________________ Laugh and the world laughs with you; cry and the world laughs AT you.

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02-13-2007, 04:36 PM	#1
busterb NSABFD Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: MS. usa Posts: 3,908	Wikipedia College: Wikipedia Not Source for Papers Feb 13, 8:21 AM (ET) MIDDLEBURY, Vt. (AP) - Middlebury College history students are no longer allowed to use Wikipedia in preparing class papers. The school's history department recently adopted a policy that says it's OK to consult the popular online encyclopedia, but that it can't be cited as an authoritative source by students. The policy says, in part, "Wikipedia is not an acceptable citation, even though it may lead one to a citable source." History professor Neil Waters says Wikipedia is an ideal place to start research but an unacceptable way to end it. 40 __________________ I've haven't left very deep footprints in the sands of time. But, boy I've left a bunch.

02-13-2007, 04:39 PM	#2
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	Fair enough.

02-13-2007, 05:20 PM	#6
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	The stronger student will edit the Wikipedia entry to correct it or fill out sections that need more information. The perfect student will create a definitive entry about a subject that previously did not exist or was only a leaf node.

02-13-2007, 05:23 PM	#7
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Sadly cellar.org does not meet Wikipedia's standards as a notable topic. If we started a page for it, other people would delete it.

02-13-2007, 05:33 PM	#12
DanaC We have to go back, Kate! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 25,964	Exactly. It's a useful skill to learn.

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