Increase in violent crime

Cyclefrance · 03-15-2007, 08:35 PM

It's easy to get dragged along by the media - like when there's one story of a a dog attacking a baby then suddenly there are three others about the same issue within days. Violent crime in the UK seems however to belong in a different category - we're seeing reports of youth-driven knife (and gun) killings two or three times a week, two even reported today - one a priest/vicar murdered in his own church grounds in Wales, and then a young boy attacked and killed in the west side of London.

Why so much knife and gun crime? Probably a combination of factors, certainly a fair share emanates from poorly thought-through legislation that paradoxically was meant to improve not destroy our way of life. For my part I see the breakdown of the family as one major area - no longer encouraged by our current government and in fact single or separate living is rewarded more by the benefits system. Loss of a balanced upbringing and the difficulties for the lone parent delivering desired results

Then there is the obsession our government has with targets - They're OK if they are carefully applied to address the real problem, but this is so seldom the case - 'tell me how you measure me and I will show you how I will act' is a phrase I have heard used to describe just how easily the wrong motivator can generate the wrong result. For our police it's a case of a target for the number of solved crimes - the more unsolved crimes left on your register the lower your rating, and there is naturally a battle to improve ratings. So why bother trying to solve the difficult time-consuming crimes when that is going to affect your ratings? - get 'em in the book! and that sadly means dealing with and looking for simple crimes to solve, like household disturbances, motoring offences and such-like. Then, of course there's the bureacracy that goes with an arrest or incident taking police time away from the job of finding the culprits.

Add large dashes of political correctness gone mad, lost opportunities to learn, absence of positive motivation, and loss of respect and responsibilty and you have the breeding ground amongst the young for gang culture spawning weapon bravado and drugs-inspired violence.

Government/political solutions at best seem to trim the problem at the edges: ASBOs that become status symbols, reward schemes that end up being abused and so on, with little attempt, energy or resources to look for and deal with the problem at its root.

God, I must be beginning to sound like Victor Meldrew, but has it always been really this bad? And will there ever be anyone with enough common-sense in power to know how to deal with this dangerously fast-escalating problem?

footfootfoot · 03-15-2007, 10:16 PM

Increase in violent crime?

I don't believe it.

03-15-2007, 10:24 PM

Because it is a myth.
We are safer than we have ever been and getting better every day.
There is less violence in schools, on our streets in our homes, everywhere.
Stop watching cable television.

WabUfvot5 · 03-15-2007, 11:47 PM

That may be true in the USA but I don't know about Britain.

03-15-2007, 11:48 PM

Look up the stats for the last twenty years. I'll bet you will be surprised.

Aliantha · 03-16-2007, 02:07 AM

Population increase leads to crime increase. That is, a proportionate increase. Also, bad news sells a lot better than good.

Don't pay attention to the media for a true indication of facts. Do some research and find out the truth for yourself.

Cyclefrance · 03-16-2007, 04:23 AM

I think there is a distinct difference now in the UK compared to say a generation ago - there's always been violence and in the past we would often here of unwarranted attacks, beatings and street fights, but not the seemingly wider-spread fatality that we are witnessing today - killings tended to be more the province of the organised gangland like the Krays, and the 'justifiable' payback of that culture. This feels, and certainly appears, different. There's a downward spiral feel to it - one negative leading to a another and another and with no effective remedy currently available.

Sheldonrs · 03-16-2007, 09:15 AM

I used to worry about the increase in violent crimes but then I realized it was easier to just shoot the messengers who tell us about it.

Cyclefrance · 03-16-2007, 11:26 AM

Try a few of these:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6457937.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6459265.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/6456035.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6434947.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6418429.stm

Sadly plenty more where they came from...

Elspode · 03-16-2007, 11:33 AM

Violent crimes enrage me. They make me want to strangle the life out of the perpetrators, then burn down their houses and kill their families...

For the humor-impaired, that was a joke. However, violent crime is no joke. Here in KC, we've got a bona-fide gang war going on, with gangstas capping each other in their cars and homes almost daily. The cops have stated that the vast majority of our homicides over the past few months are all related to one single ongoing war. They've even identified the alleged ringleader responsible for either doing the shooting, or sending minions to carry out same.

I wish they'd all just kill each other off so the rest of us can get back to being decent citizens.

Undertoad · 03-16-2007, 11:36 AM

http://www.crimestatistics.org.uk/output/Page66.asp

Violent crime in England and Wales:

Cyclefrance · 03-16-2007, 01:07 PM

..and if even much-massaged government figures admit an increase then we know how much worse it must be in reality!

Undertoad · 03-16-2007, 01:32 PM

It's odd that burglary, which was previously the bigger crime problem, is down just as much as violent crime is up:

http://www.crimestatistics.org.uk/output/page7.asp

The thugs stopped nicking anything not nailed down, and instead started stabbing people?

Is this actually a drugs problem in disguise? The US sees increases in murders during times when prohibition is more harshly enforced. When there's more profit in running a drug trade, people pay a higher price in lives.

Griff · 03-16-2007, 01:46 PM

If you throw a trend line across the trafficking graph you get an increase but nothing as abrupt as the violence...

Griff · 03-16-2007, 01:53 PM

Toad I think that is reported violent crimes. If you look here you get the numbers from the crime survey which they claim are more accurate. Maybe they're doing the neighborhood watch stuff and it is more cool to report crime?

rape is through the roof...

03-15-2007, 08:35 PM	#1
Cyclefrance Pump my ride! Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Deep countryside of Surrey , England Posts: 1,890	Increase in violent crime It's easy to get dragged along by the media - like when there's one story of a a dog attacking a baby then suddenly there are three others about the same issue within days. Violent crime in the UK seems however to belong in a different category - we're seeing reports of youth-driven knife (and gun) killings two or three times a week, two even reported today - one a priest/vicar murdered in his own church grounds in Wales, and then a young boy attacked and killed in the west side of London. Why so much knife and gun crime? Probably a combination of factors, certainly a fair share emanates from poorly thought-through legislation that paradoxically was meant to improve not destroy our way of life. For my part I see the breakdown of the family as one major area - no longer encouraged by our current government and in fact single or separate living is rewarded more by the benefits system. Loss of a balanced upbringing and the difficulties for the lone parent delivering desired results Then there is the obsession our government has with targets - They're OK if they are carefully applied to address the real problem, but this is so seldom the case - 'tell me how you measure me and I will show you how I will act' is a phrase I have heard used to describe just how easily the wrong motivator can generate the wrong result. For our police it's a case of a target for the number of solved crimes - the more unsolved crimes left on your register the lower your rating, and there is naturally a battle to improve ratings. So why bother trying to solve the difficult time-consuming crimes when that is going to affect your ratings? - get 'em in the book! and that sadly means dealing with and looking for simple crimes to solve, like household disturbances, motoring offences and such-like. Then, of course there's the bureacracy that goes with an arrest or incident taking police time away from the job of finding the culprits. Add large dashes of political correctness gone mad, lost opportunities to learn, absence of positive motivation, and loss of respect and responsibilty and you have the breeding ground amongst the young for gang culture spawning weapon bravado and drugs-inspired violence. Government/political solutions at best seem to trim the problem at the edges: ASBOs that become status symbols, reward schemes that end up being abused and so on, with little attempt, energy or resources to look for and deal with the problem at its root. God, I must be beginning to sound like Victor Meldrew, but has it always been really this bad? And will there ever be anyone with enough common-sense in power to know how to deal with this dangerously fast-escalating problem? __________________ Always sufficient hills - never sufficient gears

03-15-2007, 10:16 PM	#2
footfootfoot To shreds, you say? Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet! Posts: 18,449	Increase in violent crime? I don't believe it. __________________ The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs

03-16-2007, 02:07 AM	#6
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	Population increase leads to crime increase. That is, a proportionate increase. Also, bad news sells a lot better than good. Don't pay attention to the media for a true indication of facts. Do some research and find out the truth for yourself. __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber Last edited by Aliantha; 03-16-2007 at 02:08 AM. Reason: Had to do something to this soft mushy post

03-16-2007, 04:23 AM	#7
Cyclefrance Pump my ride! Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Deep countryside of Surrey , England Posts: 1,890	I think there is a distinct difference now in the UK compared to say a generation ago - there's always been violence and in the past we would often here of unwarranted attacks, beatings and street fights, but not the seemingly wider-spread fatality that we are witnessing today - killings tended to be more the province of the organised gangland like the Krays, and the 'justifiable' payback of that culture. This feels, and certainly appears, different. There's a downward spiral feel to it - one negative leading to a another and another and with no effective remedy currently available. __________________ Always sufficient hills - never sufficient gears

03-16-2007, 09:15 AM	#8
Sheldonrs Master Dwellar Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 4,412	I used to worry about the increase in violent crimes but then I realized it was easier to just shoot the messengers who tell us about it. __________________ Laugh and the world laughs with you; cry and the world laughs AT you.

03-15-2007, 10:24 PM	#3
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	Because it is a myth. We are safer than we have ever been and getting better every day. There is less violence in schools, on our streets in our homes, everywhere. Stop watching cable television.

03-15-2007, 11:47 PM	#4
WabUfvot5 Operations Operative Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 634	That may be true in the USA but I don't know about Britain.

03-15-2007, 11:48 PM	#5
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	Look up the stats for the last twenty years. I'll bet you will be surprised.

03-16-2007, 11:26 AM	#9
Cyclefrance Pump my ride! Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Deep countryside of Surrey , England Posts: 1,890	Try a few of these: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6457937.stm http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6459265.stm http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/6456035.stm http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6434947.stm http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6418429.stm Sadly plenty more where they came from... __________________ Always sufficient hills - never sufficient gears

03-16-2007, 11:33 AM	#10
Elspode When Do I Get Virtual Unreality? Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Raytown, Missouri Posts: 12,719	Violent crimes enrage me. They make me want to strangle the life out of the perpetrators, then burn down their houses and kill their families... For the humor-impaired, that was a joke. However, violent crime is no joke. Here in KC, we've got a bona-fide gang war going on, with gangstas capping each other in their cars and homes almost daily. The cops have stated that the vast majority of our homicides over the past few months are all related to one single ongoing war. They've even identified the alleged ringleader responsible for either doing the shooting, or sending minions to carry out same. I wish they'd all just kill each other off so the rest of us can get back to being decent citizens. __________________ "To those of you who are wearing ties, I think my dad would appreciate it if you took them off." - Robert Moog

03-16-2007, 11:36 AM	#11
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	http://www.crimestatistics.org.uk/output/Page66.asp Violent crime in England and Wales:

03-16-2007, 01:07 PM	#12
Cyclefrance Pump my ride! Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Deep countryside of Surrey , England Posts: 1,890	..and if even much-massaged government figures admit an increase then we know how much worse it must be in reality! __________________ Always sufficient hills - never sufficient gears

03-16-2007, 01:32 PM	#13
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	It's odd that burglary, which was previously the bigger crime problem, is down just as much as violent crime is up: http://www.crimestatistics.org.uk/output/page7.asp The thugs stopped nicking anything not nailed down, and instead started stabbing people? Is this actually a drugs problem in disguise? The US sees increases in murders during times when prohibition is more harshly enforced. When there's more profit in running a drug trade, people pay a higher price in lives.

03-16-2007, 01:46 PM	#14
Griff still says videotape Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 26,813	If you throw a trend line across the trafficking graph you get an increase but nothing as abrupt as the violence... __________________ If you would only recognize that life is hard, things would be so much easier for you. - Louis D. Brandeis

03-16-2007, 01:53 PM	#15
Griff still says videotape Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 26,813	Toad I think that is reported violent crimes. If you look here you get the numbers from the crime survey which they claim are more accurate. Maybe they're doing the neighborhood watch stuff and it is more cool to report crime? rape is through the roof... __________________ If you would only recognize that life is hard, things would be so much easier for you. - Louis D. Brandeis Last edited by Griff; 03-16-2007 at 02:07 PM.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)