Ode to the full service gas station

[Cloud]

which, if it isn't dead yet, is at least a dying breed. They are rapidly disappearing from the landscape.

I am, I'm ashamed to admit, unable to check the pressure on my tires myself or check or change the oil (not to mention change a tire, but that's another issue). Yeah, I know they are easy tasks, and I could learn to do them. But dammit, I don't wanna!

I used to take my car in once a month to the full service station to get the tires and fluids checked. So what if I paid a bit more for gas? I usually wouldn't even get a full tank. But now, with the price of gas, full-service is going the way of the dodo. Now there's no place to take my car to, so what am I going to do?

[Clodfobble]

Around here, all the oil change places check your tires and fluids, and often will even rotate the tires and/or top off the fluids, free of charge with the oil change.

[jinx]

Get AAA and take your car to a regular shop for maintenance. They usually have package deals oil change/fluid checks etc. I just got a bunch of coupons in the mail for maintenance crap from the place I bought my car...

[Master_At_Blubbering]

ALTERNATIVELY, YOU COULD USE THIS AS AN OPPORTUNITY TO TRY A NEW FIELD

PICK UP A SMALL REPAIR MANUAL FOR YOUR CAR ON BASIC MAINTENCE AND TURN IT INTO A SMALL HOBBY. I KNOW THIS SOUNDS LIKE IM A DUMBASS BUT SERIOUSLY STICK WITH IT FOR TWO WEEKS AND JUST CHECK THINGS

EVEN IF YOU NEVER GO BACK TO IT AGAIN YOU MIGHT LEARN SKILLS THAT YOU CAN APPLY IN OTHER AREAS OF YOUR LIFE

I FEEL THAT IN HAVING DONE SO MYSELF I AM A MORE WELL ROUNDED PERSON

[Cloud]

That's basically what I've been doing, but I need to check the oil and tires far more often than I need to change the oil or rotate the tires or something. They say tire pressure really affects your gas mileage.

I'm not great with "car stuff"--breakdowns make me very nervous, which is why I tried to buy the most reliable car I could find. But I want to take responsibility for it and keep it running for a while. I've wanted to get a tire gauge for a while, but I think there are several different kinds, and some of them are duds. Don't know which kind is good.

[tw]

Originally Posted by Cloud

... but I need to check the oil and tires far more often than I need to change the oil or rotate the tires or something. They say tire pressure really affects your gas mileage.

And miracle creams from the Pond's Institute create younger skin. Without knowledge of simple stuff, then you invite others to scam you on expensive stuff.

Why check oil and tire pressure so often? Because they know you don't know anything; would rather take advantage of you. I watch this in repair shops and dealerships. Watch, for example, how they lie to women - probably to learn how much they can overcharge. I immediately learn which service shops want to be honest. You cannot do that if, by not even learning the simplest stuff, you have set yourself up to be a mark.

There is no reason to be checking oil and tire pressure on any properly working vehicle. But 'checking' this and finding other problems occurs when 'they' see a mark.

Let's see. How often do we change spark plugs? Never once I built my first electronic ignition. Now all cars (thanks to enviromental laws) have electronic ignitions. Never replace spark plugs in a functioning car.

How often is a tune up necessary? Also never for the same reasons.

How often is wheel alignment performed? Annually? Never on a properly designed car. But when one cannot even check tire pressure, then that $100 job is recommended annually. Profit is too high and labor too simple for another fast $100.

We also learned how to lock doors. Why? Because it is not smart to remain ignornant. Certain things such as making change from a $20 without assistance from a cash register is also required in a technical society.

Why disassemble a ten speed bike? Any properly designed bike needs no such disassesmbly. A few simple cable adjustments without removing anything. Cloud, start asking some damning questions of your information sources. Learn why another could quickly see through George Jr's lies about Saddam's WMDs. It comes from doing and then learning to smell a skunk.

Many if not most service attendants in full service gas stations (all gas stations in NJ and OR are full service) also cannot check tire pressure or oil. So you trust them to do it? He says he knows and that alone is sufficient for you to trust him?

Detecting low tire pressure become easy by just looking at the tire. Learning is by first finding and filling a low pressure tire. Experience then means low pressure becomes obvious by just looking. Knowledge that comes from experience and from doing. Knowledge that makes a scammer's job too difficult.

The problem is not just knowing how to do this stuff. Too many even ignore the Check Engine light. Car runs fine. Light must be 'burned in'. Also easy to believe when one becomes Paris Hilton; never even changed a light bulb. Doing the little things means not becoming a mark. Learning by making mistakes - essential.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by tw

There is no reason to be checking oil and tire pressure on any properly working vehicle. But 'checking' this and finding other problems occurs when 'they' see a mark.

"Properly working vehicle" is not something every layman can determine. If it seems to run fine, assuming no propblem can be very bad.

Originally Posted by tw

How often is a tune up necessary? Also never for the same reasons.

Again, I have to disagree. I poke around look & check stuff all the time - my roter was excessivly worn and needed to be replaced. Nothing in the operation of the vehicle told me this. Just my being nosey and inquisitive.

Originally Posted by tw

How often is wheel alignment performed? Annually? Never on a properly designed car.

What if you drive contantly over speed bumps or hit potholes??? Both these things and many more can affect your alignment, and thust tire and brake wear. I am not a "car guy" or anything, but I know enough to be sensible. Not doing anything because you "think" things are ok is a bad idea, a very bad idea.

Originally Posted by tw

Why disassemble a ten speed bike? Any properly designed bike needs no such disassesmbly. A few simple cable adjustments without removing anything. Cloud, start asking some damning questions of your information sources. Learn why another could quickly see through George Jr's lies about Saddam's WMDs. It comes from doing and then learning to smell a skunk.

And only you tw, could bring WMD, Saddam, Bush, and dissembling a 10 speed bike in one paragraph while trying to be serious. Bravo! You never cease to amaze.

Originally Posted by tw

Doing the little things means not becoming a mark. Learning by making mistakes - essential.

On this last part I wholeheartedly agree.

[tw]

Originally Posted by classicman

What if you drive contantly over speed bumps or hit potholes??? Both these things and many more can affect your alignment, and thust tire and brake wear.

Your many replies do not contradict what I posted. For example, take wheel alignment. If potholes, etc change alignment on a properly designed car, then bent parts must be replaced. Wheel alignment would only cure symptoms. You would, instead, align to bent parts? That dirty little secret is ignored by those who advocate wheel align every year. If potholes change wheel alignment on an engineer designed car, then bent parts must first be replaced. Of course, this means buying a patriotic vehicle (American or foreign manufacturer labels say nothing about patriotic).

My 1980 Accord did 107,000 miles on its original tires. It was never wheel aligned. Why did I learn this? I even began doing my own alignment after my GM product would eat tires and the repair shop left me doubtful. Eventually discovered why it ate tires every 40,000 miles (with help from some honest mechanics and what I then learned by owning a Honda). Alignment was not changing. How wheels attached to the vehicle was causing excessive tire wear. Only myth purveyors were, instead, blaming pot holes - a universal myth.

Defective designed cars did not bother to put mounting holes in the same place on every car. A 'cost controlled' designer solved that defect by, instead, installing adjusters. Cars designed by engineers now spend more money on better designs so that the hole is exact every time and so that the total vehicle cost is less. No adjuster means no variation; no movement due to potholes.

One need not be a car guy to learn facts. Those adjusters for camber and caster do not exist on a car manufactured by patriots. How do you know? Amazingly, even simple arithmetic ballpark identifies a patriotic vehicle. Horsepower divided by liters - an engine parameter - is often associated with vehicles that also don't need wheel alignment. The minimum number should be well known here by all.

Well this may be far too much Cloud. But facts remains, all that checking is necessary for defective vehicles. Properly designed vehicles require very little maintenance - and no repeated checking.

Tune up? Tune ups do not identify a defective rotor. However simple facts such as miles per gallon and engine knocking (noise) would tend to identify such problems. Also obvious would be fluid leaks where the car parks. There is no reason for any fluid leaking beneath any car.

Again, simple observations make all that checking irrelevant. Learning to perform the simplest of task - ie checking tire pressure - eventually means one only looks at the tire to know. Even a full service gas jockey typically could not tell.

Let's not forget another myth promoted by a lying company - Firestone - now called Bridgestone. Low tire pressure does not cause tire failure. Low tire pressure can aggravate a problem directly traceable to defectively designed tires. All those Explorer rollovers are directly traceable to a company that, instead, lied. And lied repeatedly while their defective design was killing people. Who did the exact same thing in the late 1970s (find referenced to Firestone 500). Low tire pressure did not cause tires to be missing one ply or to be glued defectively.

How many knew what caused Ford Explorer rollovers? How many knew that when Ford Motor finally discovered these Firestone (Bridgestone) lies, then Ford demanded Firestone withdrawal all ATX Wilderness tires. Firestone refused. So Ford - a more patriotic company - spent $2billion to replace Firestones 'defective by design' tires. Firestone did what any MBA dominated company would do.

To mask their lies, Firestone changed the brand names to Bridgestone. A point made so that you can decide to be patriotic: either avoid Bridgestone products or so hate humanity as to buy their products. They did in the 1990s what they also did to create Firestone paraplegics and quadriplegics in the late 1970s. Will doing repeated checks (also called inspection) avoid that which more often creates failures? Of course not. Any factory that has no quality also hase quality control inspectors. But then you might blame yourself for the failures rather than the MBA who intentionally created that failure.

These stories are not universally learned. These details are often found in later (back page) newspaper stories - the dirty little details with numbers that cause so many eyes to glaze over. Automotive maintenance is also about warnings for worst case conditions; assumes no one learns (from experience) how to see a low pressure tire.

One need only learn to look at tires - to identify in but a second the tire that needs air (or more likely has a nail because a properly inflated and designed tire remains properly inflated for years). One gains that experience by first taking simple numbers with a $3 pressure gauge. One learns from experience - which means the simplest of numbers and no glazed over eyes.

[Cloud]

That's good advice. Unfortunately not for me. I've tried similar things before with poor results, and I know that I am not mechanically minded. Years ago, when I bought a really nice ten-speed bicycle, I decided I was really going to learn to take care of it. I took a class, I got and read several books, I tinkered with it. And when I finally got down to serious maintenance . . . I took it apart and could not get it together by myself.

I have lots of talents, and lots of hobbies. I know my strengths and weaknesses. I would not trust anything I did to my car myself to be right.

[jinx]

I don't check my oil, I just get it changed regularly.
Tire pressure drops with the temperature. Unless you have leaky tires it shouldn't be an issue for you more then once a year.
I have auto tire pressure sensors, even for the spare (yeah, its not annoying at all to have that info flashing at me for weeks on end because putting air in the spare is a huge PIA).

[Master_At_Blubbering]

ARE ANY OF YOUR FRIENDS MECHANICALLY MINDED? IF THAT IS THE CASE THEN MAYBE YOU CAN DO SOMETHING FOR THEM IN EXCHANGE FOR THEM CHECKING YOUR CAR OUT OCCASIONALLY

PERHAPS YOU CAN PAINT OR COOK OR DO SOMETHING FOR THEM AND SET UP A ROUTINE

YOU CAN GET MANY SERVICES VERY CHEAPLY THIS WAY IF YOU LIVE IN SMALLER AREAS WHERE IT IS NOT CONVIENT TO GO INTO TOWN AT A SERVICE STATION OR A MECHANIC

JUST MY TWO CENTS

[busterb]

Well just bless your large fonts.

[Cloud]

I predict, sometime in the future, the rise of the "luxury" gas station, back to full service.

. . . I'm waiting.

[Perry Winkle]

Okay. Who let the retards out of their pen?

(I'm not talking about Cloud, I'm talking about the shouter.)

[ZenGum]

Originally Posted by Cloud

I predict, sometime in the future, the rise of the "luxury" gas station, back to full service.

. . . I'm waiting.

How much would you be willing to pay?
Because this makes me wonder if station owners would allow independent workers to operate in their driveways. The gas is at the regular price and self serve is an option. But if you prefer, the bum who used to wash windscreens at the traffic lights will do any of the following:
pump your gas ... $1
wash your glass ...$1
check your tires ...$1
check your oil ......$1
sell you crack ... (negotiable)

S/he might spend 10 or 15 minutes doing a full check on a car, and so, allowing for downtime, might make $10-15 per hour.
I can foresee potential problems... safety for the workers, public liability, risk of scamming gas money, tax questions... What do you think? Would you pay?