Obama--the grumblings

[TGRR]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Obama's budget predicts 3.2% growth in 2010, 4% in 2011, 4.6 percent in 2012 and 4.2 percent in 2013.

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[sugarpop]

Originally Posted by classicman

Perhaps we should all just make the same amount?

I don't think that. But I also think people at the top make way more than they should, at the expense of other employees. Carly Fiorina walked away with, what, 40 million bucks after driving HP into the ground. WTF? Why is she so valuable? Why are CEOs more valuable than cops or soldiers, who put their lives on the line, or teachers, who are supposed to be teaching our future leaders? Why is a janitor less valuable? Let's face it, he has a shitier job...

its short for ok thanks goodbye

Kthxbai :p

[classicman]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Obama's budget predicts 3.2% growth in 2010, 4% in 2011, 4.6 percent in 2012 and 4.2 percent in 2013.

source source

And when HE wakes up from that dream and realizes it was just that, then what? Ohhhh we need more money - guess we'll all have to help a little more. That means tax increases on the middle class.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by classicman

And when HE wakes up from that dream and realizes it was just that, then what? Ohhhh we need more money - guess we'll all have to help a little more. That means tax increases on the middle class.

It really is limited and it will run out right after it is all given out. They only have one shot at this.

[capnhowdy]

Hey Cap'n - Happy 5th YEAR anniversary?

Yuppers... almost slipped by me.
Took me five years to post on this thread and two days to quit.
But I'll still read as you guys butcher the substandards. You know what I mean.
__________________

[TheMercenary]

Hey, it is hard to get under the bar when it was already on the ground.

[capnhowdy]

.

[Aliantha]

You know, I used to think that society was to blame for some people being stuck in the poor cycle, and to a certain extent I still do, but I've come to believe that some people are just plain stupid. It's not their fault really. They were born that way, and no amount of 'help' from society will ever change the fact that they're stupid.

My biggest challenge is that for those who were born stupid, how far should society be expected to go? Surely it's up to the families of stupid people to take care of them? I feel sorry for stupid people, but not sorry enough to think I should have to support them.

On the other hand, there's a whole bunch of people out there who're pretty damn smart but they insist on using their intelligence for bad instead of good, and get stuck in their cycle, which really just equates to another form of stupidity in my books.

The reason my opinion has changed in this regard is because of my husband. The story of his childhood would curl your toes, and yet he's educated and a leader in his field with a compassionate heart.

If you use your intelligence for good instead of bad, there's nothing you can't do.

[TGRR]

Originally Posted by Aliantha

You know, I used to think that society was to blame for some people being stuck in the poor cycle, and to a certain extent I still do, but I've come to believe that some people are just plain stupid. It's not their fault really. They were born that way, and no amount of 'help' from society will ever change the fact that they're stupid.

My biggest challenge is that for those who were born stupid, how far should society be expected to go? Surely it's up to the families of stupid people to take care of them? I feel sorry for stupid people, but not sorry enough to think I should have to support them.

On the other hand, there's a whole bunch of people out there who're pretty damn smart but they insist on using their intelligence for bad instead of good, and get stuck in their cycle, which really just equates to another form of stupidity in my books.

The reason my opinion has changed in this regard is because of my husband. The story of his childhood would curl your toes, and yet he's educated and a leader in his field with a compassionate heart.

If you use your intelligence for good instead of bad, there's nothing you can't do.

Stupidity is by no means restricted to the poor.

[Aliantha]

I never suggested it was.

[TGRR]

Originally Posted by Aliantha

I never suggested it was.

Well, then, there's a little problem with your original post. You stated an opinion that stupidity is the reason some or many poor people are poor. If that were the case, Ted Kennedy and Paris Hilton would be living under bridges.

If X percentage of poor people are stupid, and the same percentage of rich people are stupid, then you can reasonably discount stupidity as a root cause of poverty.

[Aliantha]

I think that there are some stupid wealthy people, but in the main, people who create their own wealth have employed some form of intelligence to achieve what they have, even if it's just the intelligence to work hard.

On the other hand, if people don't even have that much intelligence then yep, they'll stay poor.

Kennedy and Hilton didn't create their own wealth. They had nice little hand ups.

[TGRR]

Originally Posted by Aliantha

I think that there are some stupid wealthy people, but in the main, people who create their own wealth have employed some form of intelligence to achieve what they have, even if it's just the intelligence to work hard.

1. What percentage of truly wealthy people earned it themselves, as opposed to inheriting it?

2. I'd say the vast majority of those who DO make their own fortune don't do so by working hard. Voltaire once said that "behind every great fortune is a crime", and in the many cases, he's correct.

Originally Posted by Aliantha

On the other hand, if people don't even have that much intelligence then yep, they'll stay poor.

By that reasoning, stupid rich people should become poor.

Originally Posted by Aliantha

Kennedy and Hilton didn't create their own wealth. They had nice little hand ups.

You think the CEO of Halliburton or Exxon came out of the gutter?

[Aliantha]

If you want to talk about the elite rich who make up a very small percentage of our society, then you can do that by yourself.

I'm talking about why poor people sometimes or often stay poor due to either of my reasons stated above. I'm talking about how some poor people have the opportunity to escape 'poverty'. Not being poor doesn't mean you have to be rich. I means you're not poor. I didn't say that everyone could be mega rich if they worked hard. I suggested that some people could escape poverty if they worked hard as opposed to sitting on their arse smoking crack.

Stop twisting my words to start your own little wagon again.

btw, plenty of people have inherited money and blown the lot, or does that little factoid live outside your sphere of understanding?

[TGRR]

Originally Posted by Aliantha

If you want to talk about the elite rich who make up a very small percentage of our society, then you can do that by yourself.

I'm talking about why poor people sometimes or often stay poor due to either of my reasons stated above. I'm talking about how some poor people have the opportunity to escape 'poverty'. Not being poor doesn't mean you have to be rich. I means you're not poor. I didn't say that everyone could be mega rich if they worked hard. I suggested that some people could escape poverty if they worked hard as opposed to sitting on their arse smoking crack.

Stop twisting my words to start your own little wagon again.

btw, plenty of people have inherited money and blown the lot, or does that little factoid live outside your sphere of understanding?

1. I thought we were talking about the rich, not the middle class. My bad.

2. There's no reason to be rude.