Mueller Report

[henry quirk]

"So you feel since Trump wasn't found guilty..."

First off: he couldn't be 'found guiltly' since, of course, there hasn't been a trial.

Second: as I say, I don't care if Trump is the Devil Hisself. I hired him to be sugar in the gas tank. He's an instrument. Toss him away, folks like me will find another (or, mebbe, we'll just start shootin').

Third: no, I really don't care that 'Russians (Chinese. Ukrainians, N Koreans, etc) fucked, are fucking, will fuck, with our elections'. This is not new or news. Every nation (includin' US) mucks about in other nations' business. We can't stop them (and none of them can stop US). No, the best we can do formally is defend our processes (voting, tabulation, etc.). The best you can do: don't believe everything you read or hear, take it all with more than a grain of salt, be the gatekeeper of your head.

[Undertoad]

The Russians were/are looking to drive tribalism and create dissent. The election is a great way to do that, when it's an election year.

Intelligencer: More Than Half of Russian Facebook Ads Focused on Race

Fifty-five percent of the ads targeted race, which was also a primary angle for many of the 24 percent of ads that focused on crime or policing. The IRA’s use of divisive racial ads ramped up as Election Day approached in 2016, as well as after Trump was elected. In fact, the vast majority of ads from September 2016 to May 2017 focused on race in one way or another. And while it should be noted that many IRA ads did very poorly with Facebook users, the race-related content performed better on average.
...
The ads, which were purchased in rubles using 470 fake accounts and pages, rarely made direct references to Donald Trump, Hillary Clinton, or any of the other politicians who ran in the 2016 cycle. (Very few ads targeted swing states, either.) Instead the IRA mostly mimicked the style and tactics of identity groups on opposing sides of the American electorate and tried to reinforce or expand already existing divisions.

Slate: Russian Trolls Were Obsessed With Black Lives Matter

[henry quirk]

Toad,

As I say: don't believe everything you read or hear, take it all with more than a grain of salt, be the gatekeeper of your head.

If you don't, if you rely on others to be honest, then -- baby -- you'll be screwed up one side and down the other.

The unfortunate thing: a great many folks can't (or, have been taught to not) gate-keep their own heads. Fodder, is what they are.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Gatekeep = Only believe what you feel jibs with your opinion.

[henry quirk]

Certainly a damn-sight better than lapping up crap just cuz some smooth talker tells you it's steak.

[xoxoxoBruce]

But then you never learn anything new.

[henry quirk]

...my mind is closed, yeah.

[Undertoad]

don't believe everything you read or hear

Well that was based on the US House Intelligence that released a couple thousand ads that did actually run.

[sexobon]

US House Intelligence

Oxymoron territory.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by slang

Yes, that's the legal procedure. We'll see.

And how can you see without an investigation?

[sexobon]

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

FISA found probable cause, or there wouldn't have been an investigation

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

And how can you see without an investigation?

A red herring.

FISA standards are not the same as for criminal cases. Developing information to meet FISA probable cause standards can begin with guilt by association even though that association may turn out to be benign. This allows for the target of a politically motivated investigation to be investigated indirectly, via investigation of FISA qualifying associates, in hopes of uncovering (which hunt) damaging collaterally obtained information about the political target even when the FISA requirements for a direct investigation into that person aren't met.

That's why the investigation was into "Russian Interference" and not Presidential collusion. It enables an indictment of the political target, in the court of public opinion, while providing plausible deniability of political motivation. The true nature of the investigation is revealed; however, when adversaries of the political target set aside the investigation's unactionable findings to pursue their own investigations.

FISA has changed substantially since its inception. It's now the political sword of Damocles.

[sexobon]

Originally Posted by sexobon

… (which hunt) ...

(which witch hunt)

Auto-correct didn't know which witch is which in context.

[henry quirk]

don't believe everything you read or hear

"Well that was based on the US House Intelligence that released a couple thousand ads that did actually run."

I get that. What I'm sayin', essentially, is just cuz it comes to you by way of FB don't mean it's true. Yeah, you ought to question any- and every-thing comin' to you from government, but I was talkin' about not takin' at face value all that propaganda/advertising on FB or twitter or wikipedia or, well, from any place (or one).

The 12 year old is still wrappin' his head around the idea that the shiny interesting thing he just saw on tv probably isn't as shiny or fun as the commercial makes it out to be. On one level he gets that someone is tryin' to sell him sumthin', but on another, trusting, level he thinks 'they wouldn't lie/mislead me!'.

I think a lot of folks do this: they wisely get that propaganda exists, but foolishly believe the source they favor isn't a propaganda dump.

Me: it's all mindscrew...my default: you're a lyin' sack till I verfy otherwise. Nuthin' wrong with bein' a lyin' sack, by the way, if you're lyin' ways benefit me.

[Undertoad]

LOL. Aye-aye chief

[slang]

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

And how can you see without an investigation?

Yes, that's exactly my point. Not another investigation of Trump, a special council to investigate how and when the Mueller independent council was launched.

William Barr, Lindsey Graham, Donald Trump, Devin Nunes and a few million citizens would like some more information on this. You wouldn't deny the American people transparency, would you? Of course this is all crazy talk. We know how the Mueller investigation was launched by the testimony of those involved. They wouldn't lie, would they?

All this is just ridiculous, I know. But with all this investigation going on, what's the harm? Just for giggles? If you've got nothing to hide you have nothing to be concerned with, right?