Beware of Toddler

[kerosene]

Originally Posted by garnet

While it sounds like you're doing all the right things, I have to disagree with the statement above. I'm childless by choice--and gloriously happy about it. I don't think anyone else should have to suffer because of some kid's bad behavior, whether or not the parent has control of the situation. I've seen meals and a few weddings ruined by screaming children. I'm not saying it's the kid's or the parent's fault--afterall, kids will be kids. I just don't think you should subject other people to it unless there's absolutely no other way around it. Having kids is a choice in every sense of the word. If your choice is to have kids, great--but don't make others "deal" with your choice.

If I am in public and my kid screeches at the top of his lungs, no, there is no way around it. I can't go back in time and make it not happen. Of course, since I know how to handle it, my kid doesn't do that very often. Yes, kids will be kids.

Not having kids is your choice just like having a kid was my choice. I never said that I thought kids should be free to run around ruining the lives of innocent, blissful, childless people. I stated my impatience for people who think they know how I need to discipline my child. I don't seem to have a problem with excessive misbehavior in Jamey, so the suffering of people around that have to hear a 3 year old throw a tantrum is pretty minimal.

[jane_says]

My plan was to stay out of this, but my plans seldom work. All I have to say is that I've been on both sides of this fence - childless by choice for a long time, and now I have two.
We all have to put up with things from other people we don't approve of or like. I just stood behind a guy at the grocery store who was quite ripe. It was gross, and made me uncomfortable, but Not My Business. There are people at work whose wardrobe I think is entirely hideous, and I don't want to see navels, ass cracks, or camel toes at my place of employment. As long as they're not making me dress that way, also Not My Business. Likewise, how anyone raises their kids is Not My Business. If they're not hitting me, damaging my property or causing traffic accidents, I turn my head. I'll raise my kids and let them raise theirs. I really don't have a choice, in reality, so it's one less thing to stress over. Accepting the things I can't change, and all that.

[kerosene]

Originally Posted by jane_says

My plan was to stay out of this, but my plans seldom work. All I have to say is that I've been on both sides of this fence - childless by choice for a long time, and now I have two.
We all have to put up with things from other people we don't approve of or like. I just stood behind a guy at the grocery store who was quite ripe. It was gross, and made me uncomfortable, but Not My Business. There are people at work whose wardrobe I think is entirely hideous, and I don't want to see navels, ass cracks, or camel toes at my place of employment. As long as they're not making me dress that way, also Not My Business. Likewise, how anyone raises their kids is Not My Business. If they're not hitting me, damaging my property or causing traffic accidents, I turn my head. I'll raise my kids and let them raise theirs. I really don't have a choice, in reality, so it's one less thing to stress over. Accepting the things I can't change, and all that.

What she said

[wolf]

Most states allow for physical discipline of swats with the hand to a fleshy part of the body (i.e., buttocks). No implements may be utilized.

This definition comes from a CYS caseworker.

No, my own personal take on the biting issue? Bite back. Not hard enough to bruise, but hard enough to make an impression.

[Kitsune]

As for the people that are irritated with my child's misbehavior and find it in their place to judge my methods of discipline, they just have to deal.

I don't judge anyone's method of discipline unless it gets highly irritating and rude. The worst place: the movie theater, which caused local DVD sales and rentals to go through the roof because it became so bad. Although that has been remedied! I'm so very happy they opened an "adult-only" theater nearby, which shows the standard, wide-release movies (read: "not porn") but only allows 21 and up in. And they serve booze and unlimited popcorn. Oh, yes, it is bliss to not have to tolerate screaming infants and bawling children. Speaking of which, why do so many adults feel the need to take their 3 month old - 5 year old to a rated "R" movie?

"You know, children are much more quiet under water."

[perth]

Originally Posted by Kitsune

Speaking of which, why do so many adults feel the need to take their 3 month old - 5 year old to a rated "R" movie?

Because they're retarded.

People are really incon-fucking-siderate these days, and I also find it irritating as hell when some hellspawn is screaming at the top of their lungs and the "parent" is doing either nothing, or mollycoddling the monster. As mentioned above, on the occasions when my son does it, the first thing I do is take him away so that he is bothering as few people as possible before disciplining him. Case does the same. I think she took issue with the statement below:

Curious -- why not "5 times [spanking] on your bottom"?

and that strikes a nerve with both of us, mostly because my drunken absentee father can't grasp the concept of alternatives to spanking and loudly voices his opinion whenever possible.

Point is, regardless of how you discipine a child, you need to be consistent with it. It's not only a waste of time to make idle threats, but damaging to the kid in the long run. If you tell your kid you're gonna put em in time out, FUCKING DO IT. At the grocery store, at a restaurant, wherever.

And yeah, a movie theatre is usually an inappropriate place for a young child. Exception: Finding Nemo (or some similar kid movie) at a matinee or early evening showing. You might as well expect that. Sometimes it happens.

I do wish they would put one of those 21 and up theatres here, it's a great solution to the problem, and all movies are better when you're getting tanked.

[kerosene]

Originally Posted by perth

I do wish they would put one of those 21 and up theatres here, it's a great solution to the problem, and all movies are better when you're getting tanked.

I second that. Even us people with unruly screaming kids like to get away from the noise once in a while and drink our troubles away. :p

It suddenly struck me that several of the folks who choose not to have children and are happy with that choice are spending an awful lot of time in the <b>parenting</b> forum. Not that there is anything wrong with it, but it seems a little ironic...dontcha think??

(Don't make me start singing...you will regret it)

[kerosene]

Originally Posted by Kitsune

As for the people that are irritated with my child's misbehavior and find it in their place to judge my methods of discipline, they just have to deal.

I don't judge anyone's method of discipline unless it gets highly irritating and rude.

And rightly so, IMO. Nobody likes that.

The other day in Walgreens, there was this woman standing in line in front of me with her twin daughters, probably around 6 years old or so. One twin was quiet. The other was...not. The second twin was perpetually telling her mother how much she hated her and calling her mom a liar, while the mother just ignored her. I was pretty disgusted with it. When the mother turned around, she must have seen the involuntary look on my face, because she looked incredibly embarassed. I didn't know whether to pity the woman and her kid, or to just continue feeling disgusted. Disgust basically won out. This is the kind of thing that is truly out of line. I DO blame the mother for it. She allows it. As someone else in this thread said, the adult should be the one in control. It doesn't mean, however, that all children act like that, or all parents neglect to impose any form of discipline, if their kids aren't being spanked.

[wolf]

Originally Posted by case

It suddenly struck me that several of the folks who choose not to have children and are happy with that choice are spending an awful lot of time in the <b>parenting</b> forum. Not that there is anything wrong with it, but it seems a little ironic...dontcha think??

We have no actual experimental evidence to disrupt the notion that the advice we give about kids is perfect.

[footfootfoot]

Originally Posted by Troubleshooter

Which do you think will work better:

1) Dear Heart, that oven is very hot and will burn you...

2) NO! Followed by #1

Or, you could take my dad's approach which was basically (after you'd burned your hand):

"It's better not to do that in the first place"

I wonder if he invented the hangover cure of "Don't have so much to drink in the first place"

I have to say, though, when he said no size=7 or otherwise, we pretty much crapped ourselves.

[kerosene]

Originally Posted by wolf

We have no actual experimental evidence to disrupt the notion that the advice we give about kids is perfect.

You have a point there.

[garnet]

Originally Posted by case

I never said that I thought kids should be free to run around ruining the lives of innocent, blissful, childless people. I stated my impatience for people who think they know how I need to discipline my child. I don't seem to have a problem with excessive misbehavior in Jamey, so the suffering of people around that have to hear a 3 year old throw a tantrum is pretty minimal.

And I personally could care less how anyone disciplines their children. None of my business, and not my problem. I'm just saying that it's way too often that parents let the kids scream and yell and throw tantrums in public and subject their kid's bad behavior on everyone else. NO, I didn't say that's what YOU do. I think if the kid's throwing a fit in a restaurant, you should take him outside. Your night out may be ruined, but please don't ruin mine.

[garnet]

Originally Posted by case

It suddenly struck me that several of the folks who choose not to have children and are happy with that choice are spending an awful lot of time in the <b>parenting</b> forum. Not that there is anything wrong with it, but it seems a little ironic...dontcha think??

Hmmm, I don't remember reading that childless people were not allowed to contribute to this particular forum. I personally read all the different forums on occasion--some interest me more than others, so I spend more time in those.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by case

It suddenly struck me that several of the folks who choose not to have children and are happy with that choice are spending an awful lot of time in the <b>parenting</b> forum. Not that there is anything wrong with it, but it seems a little ironic...dontcha think??

Ironic, that we should investigate and comment on, how these giant expenses for us are being raised? No.

[LabRat]

Well, the biting has in my opinion become less of a problem, at least it is not getting worse. So, I plan on continuing my current discipline's direction till it's not. My goal in starting this thread was to get info from ANYONE who has either gone thru this, or been sufficiently involved in a childs life as to have working knowledge of this problem and therefore give good advice as to what worked (or not!) for them (or someone close to them). I am digesting all the commentary so far, and I definately agree that 1) whatever i do, it must be consistantly applied as a form of dicipline, by everyone my child spends significant amounts of time with; and 2) spanking works in rare situations, and i will spank if I deem it necessary, tho so far I feel she has never needed it because she knows my "vengeful god" voice means i'm serious (because i'm not afraid to leave my cart in the store and leave if that's what is needed etc.) So far, things have never escalated to the point where spanking was my last resort. I agree that certain types of discipline only teach one to not get caught instead of not doing it in the first place, and that is what I am trying to avoid!! Please, contuniue the discussion, I value all the opinions presented, from all

PS What the hell is anyone doing bringing kids to a movie theater to see a movie that's not specifically designed for kids?? I have also seen infants at stock car races...WITHOUT ear protection. Even I wear earplugs for pete's sake, nerdy or not.