Unpopular opinions you hold

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Think about it next time they slip the handcuffs on and you have no idea why.
Or you spend thirty years building a business and the government passes a law that puts you out of business.
How about when your spouse goes out for a pack of smokes and never comes back.
Or when your mother dips you in protection, all but your heel.

Are you abdicating responsibilty for those things? Is it that God works in mysterious ways? Or coincidence? Shit happens?

You did have some influence in all those things. Your choices put you there. It may have not worked according to plan, but you did make choices, and those choices had those results.

[Pie]

You are responsible for your actions, not their outcomes.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Pie

You are responsible for your actions, not their outcomes.

And that, my friends, is what is wrong with America today.

[DanaC]

Don't see why. Clearly you have absolute responsibility and control over your actions: unless you have a crystal ball you are unlikely to be able to predict all the myriad outcomes from every single action. The Sliding Doors moments, so to speak.

[Pie]

Originally Posted by Pie

You are responsible for your actions, not their outcomes.

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

And that, my friends, is what is wrong with America today.

Take it another way -- you are only responsible for doing your absolute best in all circumstances. What happens as a result of that is not yours, either for blame or praise. You own your actions and nothing else.

How is this a problem for America?

[elSicomoro]

Originally Posted by DanaC

unless you have a crystal ball

As a matter of fact, I do have a crystal ball...it doesn't tell me anything, but it sure is pretty.

[HungLikeJesus]

Originally Posted by Pie

Take it another way -- you are only responsible for doing your absolute best in all circumstances. What happens as a result of that is not yours, either for blame or praise. You own your actions and nothing else.

How is this a problem for America?

This implies that one cannot possibly predict or anticipate the consequences of their actions.

For example, cane toads were imported into Australia "from South America during the 1930s in a failed attempt to control beetles on Australia's northern sugar cane plantations. The poisonous toads have proven fatal to Australia's delicate ecosystems, killing millions of native animals from snakes to the small crocodiles that eat them." http://www.livescience.com/animalwor...iant_toad.html

Were the importers of the toads not responsible for the negative results of introducing a foreign species? (Same with the rabbits.)

[Undertoad]

(btw, we are on target for a cane toad iotd tomorrow)

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Pie

Take it another way -- you are only responsible for doing your absolute best in all circumstances. What happens as a result of that is not yours, either for blame or praise. You own your actions and nothing else.

How is this a problem for America?

So you get in a car and drive drunk. You are responsible for that action. An hour later as you drive you kill a mother of three and her children in a head on collision. You say you are not responsible. How?

[Sundae]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

So you get in a car and drive drunk. You are responsible for that action. An hour later as you drive you kill a mother of three and her children in a head on collision. You say you are not responsible. How?

Action - driving while drunk
Result - Head on collision and death of innocent people
Conclusion - The driver is fully responsible because he made a decision that was illegal and immoral knowing that his ability was impaired

Action - Driving your kids to the swimming pool
Result - Hit by a drunk driver and killed along with your children
Conclusion - the mother took an action she believed was healthy and responsible. Her children would be alive if she hadn't signed them up for swimming lessons but she is not responsible for their deaths, despite the fact that her action led to it.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Sundae Girl

Action - driving while drunk
Result - Head on collision and death of innocent people
Conclusion - The driver is fully responsible because he made a decision that was illegal and immoral knowing that his ability was impaired

Action - Driving your kids to the swimming pool
Result - Hit by a drunk driver and killed along with your children
Conclusion - the mother took an action she believed was healthy and responsible. Her children would be alive if she hadn't signed them up for swimming lessons but she is not responsible for their deaths, despite the fact that her action led to it.

Goes both ways eh?

[Sundae]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

Goes both ways eh?

Oh yes - but that's what I think Pie was saying. If you are doing the best you can, you hope that your actions don't have bad consequences. But you can't guarantee it.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Sundae Girl

Oh yes - but that's what I think Pie was saying. If you are doing the best you can, you hope that your actions don't have bad consequences. But you can't guarantee it.

Ok, if that is the case I get it. It did not read that way when first posted to me. Makes sense.

[HungLikeJesus]

We all drive almost every day. We all know the risks of being on the road. But what percentage of drivers take action to improve their driving skills (winter driving course, defensive driving course, etc.) to reduce those risks?

Since many collisions could have been avoided by a driver with advanced training, those of us who don't make that effort bear an increased percentage of the responsibility when we are involved in an accident.

A similar arguement can be made for self-defense training.

[Pie]

Originally Posted by Sundae Girl

Oh yes - but that's what I think Pie was saying. If you are doing the best you can, you hope that your actions don't have bad consequences. But you can't guarantee it.

Exactly. You are responsible for doing the best you can. Ethically, morally, and every which other way. Always.

If something bad happens as a result, it is not your fault.

If something good happens, it is not to your praise.

However, if you don't do the best you can by your own yardstick, you are always to blame, even if nothing bad comes of it.