I don't have a dog in this fight, but...

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by ZenGum

Merc, nothing there is in his "personal" life. Plenty of questionable things in his *political* life, but nothing from his personal life.

Did he break his marriage vows? Has he married and divorced multiple times? Did he screw around in college? (not that this would bother many people). Did he drink or gamble or use drugs? Did he drive drunk (drowning staffers optional)? Was he a juvenile delinquent?

That is what people usually mean by "personal life".

So you have never read his book? Please just admit that much to me. I have read it.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Happy Monkey

You're not going to get an answer, Lamplighter.

Defend him if you can....

[Lamplighter]

During his acceptance speech in 1984 as Democratic nominee for President,
Walter Mondale said:

"By the end of my first term, I will reduce the Reagan budget deficit by two-thirds.
Let's tell the truth. It must be done, it must be done.
Mr. Reagan will raise taxes, and so will I. He won't tell you. I just did."

I have a memory of this moment because of the stunned silence that followed.
While this was meant to show that Mondale would be honest with voters,
it was largely interpreted as a campaign pledge to raise taxes.
Mondale's loss was catastrophic: winning only District of Columbia and his home state, Minnesota

Yesterday during the GOP candidates' debate,
Newt Gingrich may have just made the same sort of statement on "llegal immigration"

“I don’t see how the party that says it’s the party of the family is going to adopt
an immigration policy which destroys families that have been here a quarter century,”

“And I’m prepared to take the heat for saying let’s be humane in enforcing the law
without giving them citizenship, but by finding a way to create legality
so that they are not separated from their families.”

"I want to be tough, but I'm not willing to kid people," he said after the debate.
"I can't imagine any serious person in this country that wants
to tear families apart that have been here for 20 years."

[Lamplighter]

Gingrich said in the Republican debate Tuesday night.
"I'm prepared to take the heat for saying let's be humane in enforcing the law."

And so it begins....

Associated Press
Charles Babington
Nov 23, 2011
Gingrich risk: Will the GOP cast its lot with him?

"Illegal immigration is Newt's acid test," Scala said,
and tea party conservatives might be "having second thoughts today.
Let's see if he can keep them on board."

"Newt Gingrich is finished!" said William Gheen, president of the anti-immigration group ALIPAC.

Rep. Steve King, R-Iowa, one of Congress' most outspoken conservatives,
said Gingrich's prescription "is a form of amnesty" that "makes it harder" to consider endorsing him.

Romney offered Gingrich no wiggle room.
While campaigning in Iowa, he said, "People who have come to the country illegally
should not have a special pathway that is preferable to those that
stand in line in their home countries to come to this country."

Romney said Gingrich's plan would not stand scrutiny.
"How about someone who's been here 20 years, how about 12 years, about 10, five, three?"
he said. "How many children do you have to have to apply to this principle?"

"If 2012 were an ordinary election year, Gingrich would be doomed
by his gaffes, three marriages and fleeting alliances with Hillary Clinton on health care
and Nancy Pelosi on global warming," columnist Fred Barnes wrote in the Weekly Standard.
But Republicans are obsessed with ousting President Barack Obama, he said.

"And if that means choosing a candidate with a lurid past and a penchant for self-destruction,"
Barnes said, then Republicans "are likely to swallow hard and nominate Gingrich."

[BigV]

this tiff is why the fundamentalists of any stripe, religious, political, conservative, etc are an evolutionary dead end. They cannot change with the times. they box themselves in like this--no legal for you, come back 11 years! just ridiculous.

[tw]

The term is "standing by your principles". What it really means it blindly following a political agenda without question or doubt.

Gingrich has made some comments that would be unacceptable among extremists. For example, he rates Obama A+ for America's foreign policy and accomplishments. He has also stood up for long term illegal immigrants who, as we all should know, are essentially American citizens without all the rights. Both contradict party "principles".

Comments like that are too ‘moderate’. Or what extremists call the liberal elite. Can Gingrich ride the same moderate support that gave McCain the domination?

BTW, Mondale was right. Reagan did increase taxes. But in a way that permitted a myth of lower taxes to live on today.

[TheMercenary]

Well I guess Gingrich is going the way of Mondale. Nothing wrong with that I suppose. Better than the lies we have been getting since.

[Lamplighter]

The Democratic National Committee seems to believe that Mitt Romney will be the GOP candidate.
The DNC have started an ad campaign on this assumption.
There is a short (40 sec) ad that gives the flavor of the anti-Mitt campaign,
and then gives a link to their longer (4 min) ad, below:




ETA: Sorry for the edit, my copy/paste went astray

And besides all that:

The DNC should be careful what they wish for... they may get it.

Newt Gingrich is not, by any means, out of the running (yet).
The endorsement below is important in the New Hampshire primary.

Politico
JOSEPH W. MCQUAID - NEW HAMPSHIRE UNION LEADER
11/28/11

New Hampshire Union Leader endorses Gingrich

This newspaper endorses Newt Gingrich in the New Hampshire Presidential Primary.

<snip>
We are in critical need of the innovative, forward-looking strategy and positive leadership
that Gingrich has shown he is capable of providing. He did so with the Contract with America.
He did it in bringing in the first Republican House in 40 years and by forging balanced budgets
and even a surplus despite the political challenge of dealing with a Democratic President.

A lot of candidates say they're going to improve Washington.
Newt Gingrich has actually done that, and in this race he offers the best shot of doing it again.<snip>

Truth be known, many in the liberal media are belittling the Republican candidates
because they don't want any of them to be taken as a serious challenger to their man, Obama.<snip>

Newt Gingrich is by no means the perfect candidate.
But Republican primary voters too often make the mistake of preferring
an unattainable ideal to the best candidate who is actually running.

[classicman]

Newt is the flavor of the month, I hope.
Got any recipes?

[Lamplighter]

Oh pith the thought.

[Lamplighter]

Frankly, I am getting tired of reading of Herman Cain's exploits.
Not that I'm jealous, but instead I'm bored.
The women keep coming and Cain keeps denying.
But anyhow, here's the latest:

Christian Science Monitor
Amanda Paulson
November 28, 2011

Herman Cain has refuted allegations of a 13-year affair with an Atlanta woman, Ginger White.

She says she was upset by how Herman Cain treated those accusing him of sexual harassment.

In a press conference addressing sexual-harassment allegations three weeks ago,
the GOP presidential candidate hinted that more women might come forward,
saying that "there will probably be others."

On Monday, that proved true.

Mr. Cain appeared with Wolf Blitzer on CNN to preempt the accusations
of a 13-year extramarital affair and dismiss them as false –
even before the woman spoke on an Atlanta Fox affiliate.

He was unequivocal in his denials when asked directly whether he had
had sex or an affair with the woman, but he admitted that he knew her.
"It is someone that I know who is an acquaintance that I thought was a friend,"

As proof of the affair, White showed her interviewers her cellphone,
which had "Herman Cain" as a contact, and phone bills showing 61 calls or texts
to that number during a four-month period.

And besides all that:

A good man is always willing to help out his acquaintances financially.
and it ain't wrong if everybody's doing it...

When the station texted that number, Cain responded, telling the station
that he knew White, but that her allegations were false,
and that she had his number because he was "trying to help her financially.

And certainly, Cain would hardly be the only candidate with sexual indiscretions in his past.
It's a category that includes Newt Gingrich, the current GOP front-runner,
who is on his third marriage and has had at least two extramarital affairs (with women he later married).

[classicman]

Still don't care about Cain's issues with women. He isn't fit to lead the country.
His ideas are awful. Thats enough for me.

[DanaC]

Originally Posted by classicman

Still don't care about Cain's issues with women. He isn't fit to lead the country.
His ideas are awful. Thats enough for me.

Bing.

The man is just not of a high enough calibre, in any way, to lead any country let alone the fucking United States of America.


I swear, Merkins, if you lot allow that man to be your president the rest of us are going to be really fucking annoyed.

[BigV]

Cain Reassessing

Updated 12:14 p.m. Eastern Time

The Herman Cain campaign is "reassessing" its strategy in the wake of a woman's claim that she and Cain had engaged in a 13-year extramarital relationship, a senior staffer to the campaign told CBS News.

The staffer made the statement following reports that Cain told supporters Tuesday morning that he is reassessing whether to remain in the Republican presidential race.

On a five-minute conference call, Cain told his senior staff that he would make a decision on staying in the race "over the next several days," according to National Review.

And the Des Moines Register reports that Cain said on the call that he needs to decide if the affair allegation creates "too much of a cloud" for him to continue his run.

"If a decision is made, different than we should plow ahead, you all will be the first to know," Cain reportedly said on the 90-person conference call.

Perhaps it was the smell of fear that brought out the predators, but now it seems Cain feels there's actual blood in the water. Like classicman, I don't really think that how he conducts his personal affairs is important to his quality as a leader. I *DO* think how he responds to such questions is telling and Cain's mishandled this from the outset.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by Lamplighter

The women keep coming

You'd think he's a Democrat