Obama--the grumblings

[tw]

Originally Posted by tw

We do know one fact. Tax cuts without spending reductions only create short term economic improvement followed by worse economic downturns. Eliminting those destructive tax cuts are necessary to restore actual productivity (and responsiblity) to the economy.

Originally Posted by Undertoad

We'll know by second quarter next year.

Any recovery that does not create further recession will appear typically many years later. Once we eliminate the salesmen, honest statements based in study of other recessions define economic recover in more like four years.

Salesman (ie stock brokers) are promoting a turn around in a year or less. They are promoting sales - not honesty. The economy has been harmed so badly for almost a decade. Time for everyone to pay for a decade of welfare to the rich. This is how economics takes revenge for wealth created by money games.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by capnhowdy

Also, taxes would be collected from drug dealers, prostitutes, scam artists, cash only 'contractors', etc.

How would you propose to accomplish that? Voluntary disclosure?

[TGRR]

Originally Posted by capnhowdy

Can you post anything but a goddam request for data? WTF are you trying to "back up"? C'mon man... don't be a dick.

I found his statement to be a bit of a stretch. However, I do not KNOW this, so I asked him to back his argument. Since he posted the claim, the burden of proof is on him. Debate 101.

Now, hush. Adults are talking.

[TGRR]

Originally Posted by capnhowdy

And why should anyone need to "back up" their opinion?

He didn't express it as an opinion. He offered a statement of fact.

[capnhowdy]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

How would you propose to accomplish that? Voluntary disclosure?

Every time you buy something, you pay a flat rate sales tax. No disclosure. You got it, you spend it, you pay the tax. You don't have it, you can't spend it, you don't pay the tax. There's nowhere to hide. This is my opinion, Bruce. Like I said in the posts you must have skipped, It will prolly never fly but I think it would be fair.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Oh, got ya. You're not talking about a flat tax, you're talking about a sales tax. Sorry, I misunderstood you.

[capnhowdy]

No prob. I need to stay outa this thread anyway.

And tggr ... you can have it asshole. You're trolling and you know it. You attack me and everybody else on this thread. I refuse to lower myself to your level. If you wanna troll, I'm not gonna feed you.

[TGRR]

Originally Posted by capnhowdy

No prob. I need to stay outa this thread anyway.

And tggr ... you can have it asshole. You're trolling and you know it. You attack me and everybody else on this thread. I refuse to lower myself to your level. If you wanna troll, I'm not gonna feed you.

Um, yes. Your outburst at me for disagreeing with you, alongside your "I served. Your argument is invalid.", and then followed with your hollering at me about how I post with others constitutes trolling on MY part.

[sugarpop]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

Do you honestly think that individual contractors and small business owners report all of their income? I know three people who are good friends who make well over $70 a year and report only $30. In this economy it is even easier to report a loss and get further tax breaks. If all the people who ran a cash business reported their income and let it be taxed we wouldn't need to raise taxes. You have a hang up with socio-economic classes.

Duh. That goes without saying. Of course people don't report all their income. If people making only 70k/year are doing it, imagine how much people are doing it who make a lot more.

And I am not the one with the hangup. I just want people who make a lot of money to pay what they should be paying. They don't. You just admitted that people you know don't report all their income. You said you don't care about taxes being raised because you will hide most of your money. So how is it I'm the one with the hangup? If you're really doing that, how is that fair? It isn't.

[sugarpop]

Originally Posted by capnhowdy

pssssstttt......

We always have and always will have a permanent lower class.
Some people just refuse to rise above it.

Jesus Christ. yea, blame poor people for being poor. Read some Jonathan Kozol, please.

[TheMercenary]

But I can't hide my money. It goes through a bank, which along with my employers report my income on W-2's and 1099's. I can only shield my income from further taxation by maximizing my legal pre-tax deductions and taking every other deduction I can legally take. What is not fair is that I pay for people who don't pay taxes, while 42% of my income goes to the government. Where is the incentive? The incentive under these taxation programs is to be poor and let the government pay for your needs.

The whole point is that billions are lost to people who do not report income. I cannot do that.

[sugarpop]

Originally Posted by capnhowdy

And why should anyone need to "back up" their opinion?

You won't last long here with that opinion. Everyone here wants you to back up what you say. Sometimes it can be a little annoying, but I understand why people do it.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by sugarpop

Duh. That goes without saying. Of course people don't report all their income. If people making only 70k/year are doing it, imagine how much people are doing it who make a lot more.

And I am not the one with the hangup. I just want people who make a lot of money to pay what they should be paying. They don't. You just admitted that people you know don't report all their income. You said you don't care about taxes being raised because you will hide most of your money. So how is it I'm the one with the hangup? If you're really doing that, how is that fair? It isn't.

Name one, ONE waitress who claims all her tips, or pizza delivery guy... or the furniture delivery guy or the postman who gets $10 or $20 bucks for Christmas. How bout the Deli that takes cash only? The guy you buy your christmas tree from.... C'mon are you serious?
Wrong is wrong.
Kthxbai

Originally Posted by sugarpop

You won't last long here with that opinion. Everyone here wants you to back up what you say. Sometimes it can be a little annoying, but I understand why people do it.

lol - Don't be speakin' for me there, snap crackle sugarpop.
Hey Cap'n - Happy 5th YEAR anniversary?

[TGRR]

Originally Posted by classicman

Name one, ONE waitress who claims all her tips, or pizza delivery guy... or the furniture delivery guy or the postman who gets $10 or $20 bucks for Christmas. How bout the Deli that takes cash only? The guy you buy your christmas tree from.... C'mon are you serious?
Wrong is wrong.
Kthxbai

Our nation is broke because waitresses don't declare their tips?

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by TGRR

Our nation is broke because waitresses don't declare their tips?

http://cellar.org/showpost.php?p=539882&postcount=264