Hey, everybody, I could use some input!

Originally Posted by Undertoad

FWIW I'm with James on this one. Any relatively open forum is going to fill up with crap if people let it. From time to time a "true" attention whore such as April comes around, and I will let such situations linger whilst we figure out whether we can do anything gracious for them, such as reforming them with a series of complaints.

Mari is certainly not at that level, but she's trying hard. She annoys me, but my opinion is worth about the same as all y'alls on that point.

Marichiko 0, LJ 100

This is YOUR board, UT and it's YOUR dime. I would not retire so tamely from the field in different circumstances, but you're the boss here and as far as I'm concerned you have just served me with due warning. If you prefer posters like LJ to hang out here over someone like me, than I HAVE been posting on the wrong board. The management sets the tone of an establishment and I am definitely declasse' in this one.

It's been great talking to almost all of you and I wish you all well.

[lookout123]

Mari - don't get too melodramatic on this one. UT didn't tell you to shut up or get out. he simply said your posts irritate him at times. let's face it, we all irritate each other to varying degrees at different times. show of hands - anybody here just get glassy eyed with frustration when tw and i get into our occasional urination battles? (you can all put your hands down now).

until UT pulls the plug you are free to annoy or amuse to your heart's content. maybe i'm wrong but i think the value in the cellar is that we are all welcome here even when we are annoying.

let's see, we have:

LJ- he's annoying when he only shows up to stir the pot, and really annoying when someone flips his instant a$$hole switch. (religion)

Mari - she's annoying when she starts talking about the downtrodden or anything to do with the military.

Jag - he's a flaming liberal and decidedly anti-american. (damn foreigner)

tw - if he were any more liberal he would burst into flames.

Radar - no, no i can't think of anything that radar does that is annoying.

wolf and slang - well, hell, they are always shooting people

garnet - she lashes out in her own little form of poopstirring.

UT - what isn't annoying about an absolute rock god?

and me - i voice an opinion on every issue and usually two, and i usually take a thread 2 days past it's death.

what i'm trying to say is SHUT THE HELL UP ALREADY! it's the cellar, we annoy each other, blah blah blah. let's argue about something worthwhile - like how you think the new fat albert movie is going to do at the box office.

[garnet]

How sad that we've lost another person (just like we lost Brianna). And none of the new people ever stick around for more than one or two posts.

[lookout123]

that is nothing new, garnet. if you haven't noticed we are still new people. pull up the old threads and see how many names you recognize. people come and are really active for awhile then get bored, or annoyed, or busy and move on. most people tend to come back when the prozac kicks in or they see a thread worth contributing to.

when there aren't really interesting threads to elicit discussion we end up with this thread - just pointless arguing for the sake of posting.

[Elspode]

New cellar tagline -

The Cellar - Shut Up and Pay Attention, We Eat People Like You for Lunch

[Elspode]

Originally Posted by lumberjim

tshirt, cd thing, gobs and gobs of laughing people.

While I always appreciate an opportunity to support The Cellar, I wouldn't cite the T-Shirt effort with a lot of prominence...some of us didn't get one...or two...or four.

And no, I *still* don't want my money back.

[jinx]

Originally Posted by Elspode

While I always appreciate an opportunity to support The Cellar, I wouldn't cite the T-Shirt effort with a lot of prominence...some of us didn't get one...or two...or four.

And no, I *still* don't want my money back.

That's a huge bummer Elspode, I wish the t-shirt guy hadn't been such a fuck up, I didn't get a couple of mine either. But Jim put a lot of work and time into organizing the whole thing, gratis, and the cellar did profit from the endeavor- he did his part and then some.

[Undertoad]

I like and dislike various people here just like everyone, although I don't truly get pissed at anyone. The difference is that somehow when I say it, it's supposed to be more meaningful. It isn't. Unless someone is truly messing up the community in some way, how I feel about them has no bearing on whether they should or should not be here.

In fact, the whole place has meant different things to me personally at different times, but when it's not particularly as interesting as usual, I just bypass threads and wait until it IS more interesting.

I have put a good deal of money into it, but when the recent hardware problems arose, people were generous enough to contribute enough to repay all of the money I spent on the problems, and to start well on the way to getting the system its own dedicated hardware. My big outlay is in time, but hey it's a hobby.

(I like all the oldtimers, which pretty much includes everyone here more than a year, so please don't nobody go getting all paranoid on me)

[lookout123]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

(I like all the oldtimers, which pretty much includes everyone here more than a year, so please don't nobody go getting all paranoid on me)

so what you are saying is that you hate all of us that have been here for less than one year? i can read between the lines and get what you mean. what's that? you want us all to spontaneously combust if we don't drown in a pool of our own vomit first???

damn, that is harsh UT, i really didn't think you would stoop that low.

[jinx]

Originally Posted by lookout123

damn, that is harsh UT, i really didn't think you would stoop that low.

He's on such a power trip with this place. It's disgusting really.

[Undertoad]

That's it, you two are banned.

[BrianR]

I'm bummed that I didn't make lookout's list...

[tw]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

I like and dislike various people here just like everyone, although I don't truly get pissed at anyone. The difference is that somehow when I say it, it's supposed to be more meaningful. It isn't. Unless someone is truly messing up the community in some way, how I feel about them has no bearing on whether they should or should not be here.

In fact, the whole place has meant different things to me personally at different times, but when it's not particularly as interesting as usual, I just bypass threads and wait until it IS more interesting.

As a result, the Cellar is constantly changing. Change is necessary. Not just going from a BBS to the internet. For example, how many remember Ghost - an openly acknolwedged gay kid who was brutally attacked for defending his rights. Of (I forgot his name) who wrote some great porn.

A simple rule for any healthy community: personal attack without logical reasoning is taboo. Where, pray tell, is anyone annoying? No one. Not even Lumberjim. Even when lookout123 labels me a liberal, it is his opinion and (from my perspective) is not a personal attack. What he perceives as liberal - anything that is not right wing extremist. At least his flawed logic is understandable. Perspective. I believe he truly believes he is a centrist. He is misguided. But that is a logical conclusion - from my perspective. IOW to be an decent human, first look at how HE perceives things. Emotion has no place in decision - except at the very end to judge whether the logical conclusion makes sense.

What has changed? Every so often, one will post crap - insult another without any factual basis. Lumberjim openly acknowledges why he attacks marichiko. She annoys him. So what? Logic has nothing to do with his conclusions. He is venomous when he uses only emotion to jusitify his conclusions.

As UT once said, this board is not for 17 year olds. Why? Boys and girls let emotions override their logic. Not acceptable from adults. Unfortunately Lumberjim who had stopped posting emotionally (since his personal attacks on April) has returned to his mistaken ways.

Again, enemy of this community are those who post pure emotion unsupported by any logical reasoning.

Let's not forget the original post. Marichiko was simply asking for advise. Nothing she posted should have caused emotion in any adult. There was no whining - if you had read logically. If it bothered you as it bothered Lumberjim, then you have two actions. First you should not reply. Second, you should deal with your mental weaknesses - letting emotion (the head between your legs) override your logic (the head between your shoulders).

[elSicomoro]

OK, UT, so Mari annoys you. Fair enough...at least you expressed it without being venomous this time. So, how would you explain your blow-up last week with the whole Communism argument (which you took out on at least 3 people)? If it is was just a rough day, hey, I understand. But that seemed rather out of character for you.

[lookout123]

Even when lookout123 labels me a liberal, it is his opinion and (from my perspective) is not a personal attack. What he perceives as liberal - anything that is not right wing extremist. At least his flawed logic is understandable. Perspective. I believe he truly believes he is a centrist. He is misguided. But that is a logical conclusion - from my perspective

now this is the way to start a good argument, i mean discussion. tw, FWIW i just threw you in there because everyone has witnessed our pissing matches. i don't view myself as a centrist. i'm right of center on most issues. just as you are not a centrist either - you are to the left on most issues. that doesn't make you wrong and me right - we just have different priorities based on our respective world views.

I'm bummed that I didn't make lookout's list...

sorry man, i could have gone on and on and... just trying to make a point and release a little pressure in the cellar.