The Current Crop of Candidates

richlevy · 07-08-2007, 08:13 PM

After the fiasco of the last two elections, I have been holding out hope that the next election will be an 'issues' debate between two experienced and intelligent candidates with broad support within both parties. Instead of a 'lesser of two evils approach, to be presented with a difficult choice between two candidates, either of which I believed to be a suitable candidate.

I just seem to get the impression that the most substantive candidates seem to be the 2nd tier in both parties.

I think Hillary is smart, but I think she has a polarizing effect.
I really like Richardson on paper, and so far he has not disappointed me, but as with all 2nd tier candidates, the question becomes would he change if he moved up to the 1st tier.
Obama talks a great game, but so did GWB to his party faithful. I just would like to see a longer Obama resume.
McCain has been a disappointment ever since he derailed the 'straight talk express' and became another politician selling himself for the prize.
Romney and Guliani seem to be trying to reinvent themselves every minute.
Fred Thompson is wisely keeping his mouth shut, which automatically makes him a viable candidate. I heard that appearance aside, he was a "gentleman's C" kind of legislator, putting in a fair but unremarkable effort and carrying a light to modest workload.

Obama really does appear to be the 'take me as I am candidate'. My issue with him is the great unknown. He spoke out against the war, but he wasn't in Congress at the time and he was speaking as a private citizen, not as someone who had to make a real decision on incomplete (and now known to be faulty) information.

I'm hoping that the 2nd tier can hang around in reserve for a while.

If I could pick my own nominating debates, it would be Richardson against Hillary for the Democrats and between Ron Paul (or Tom Tancredo) against Mike Huckabee for the Republican nomination.

I'm almost sorry Cheney isn't running. I'd like to see conservatives like Paul or Tancredo rip into him for pretty much everything he's done.

piercehawkeye45 · 07-08-2007, 09:25 PM

I personally would rather see Edwards or Obama than Hilary. The part that really scares me about her is the Universal Health Plan. Both Obama and Edwards says that we need to raise taxes for universal health care but Hilary says we don't. There are no secret operations so I really doubt Hilary is seeing something that the other two don't. That means one of four things:

She is lying and will raise taxes
Her plan will fall apart due to lack of funding
She will take money from other places (social security for example)
Her plan will not have the coverage as Edward's or Obama's

I have not looked into all three plans that closely but unless I missed something, one of those four are going to happen and that type of incompetence is really starting to annoy me. We can see a problem beforehand but no one is willing to do anything about it.

Her attitude on the war in Iraq is also another thing. She keeps calling it "Bush's war" when she does nothing to stop it and when she even voted for it in the first place without researching it thoroughly.

This is a serious question. Why do people like Hilary? Besides experience, I haven't seen anything except deception and vote whoring.

Quote:

I'm hoping that the 2nd tier can hang around in reserve for a while.

I agree with this on both sides.

xoxoxoBruce · 07-08-2007, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by richlevy

After the fiasco of the last two elections, I have been holding out hope that the next election will be an 'issues' debate between two experienced and intelligent candidates with broad support within both parties. ~snip

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. Good one, Rich. I can picture them trying to address issues, while pandering to everyone, on everything.

yesman065 · 07-08-2007, 10:15 PM

Further proof that hope springs eternal! I'm right there with you Rich, although a bit more skeptical.

TheMercenary · 07-08-2007, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by richlevy

After the fiasco of the last two elections, I have been holding out hope that the next election will be an 'issues' debate between two experienced and intelligent candidates with broad support within both parties. Instead of a 'lesser of two evils approach...

I would agree with that much. To bad, as much I don't like it, I don't think there is much that can stop Hitlery from becoming President. Obama is running a good show, in fact a model for what a campaign should look like, without all the partisan BS. To bad he is black, because this country is still radically polarized and to racist to vote for him. I like mostly second tier candidates as well.

piercehawkeye45 · 07-09-2007, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

I would agree with that much. To bad, as much I don't like it, I don't think there is much that can stop Hitlery from becoming President. Obama is running a good show, in fact a model for what a campaign should look like, without all the partisan BS. To bad he is black, because this country is still radically polarized and to racist to vote for him. I like mostly second tier candidates as well.

I would be curious to see how many people would not vote for Obama just because he is black and how many people would vote for him just because he is black.

Rexmons · 07-09-2007, 08:46 AM

I'd vote for him [Obama] but i think it would be useless due to the millions of Red Staters that would rather have a white devil in office than a black saint. Unless of course Dubya has actually left such a bad taste in their mouths as well, that they'll vote as far away from his type as possible. :fingerscrossed:

skysidhe · 07-09-2007, 10:14 AM

Seems like we all pretty much second your opinions Rich.

I would say the same things about the same canadates as you did. It's amazing the clarity regular american people come up with. What's wrong with politics these days?

The fact we chose someone we would like to go have a beer with is quite disturbing. No wait. Al Gore won the popular vote. I keep forgetting.

People better get out and vote to keep people like McCain,Rommney and Guliani out. Some of the lesser democrates don't even have a chance but the Rebublican spin machine is an evil tool.

TheMercenary · 07-09-2007, 08:38 PM

Hitlery with Obama as the VP would be un-stoppable.... Right that down.

skysidhe · 07-09-2007, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

Hitlery with Obama as the VP would be un-stoppable.... Right that down.

piercehawkeye45 · 07-10-2007, 12:26 AM

Realistically, I wouldn't mind an Obama-Edwards duo since they seem to be at least on the same page.

But Merc, was that a joke or not? Can you explain?

Rexmons · 07-10-2007, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

Hitlery with Obama as the VP would be un-stoppable.... Right that down.

Merc, in response to this comment:

TheMercenary · 07-10-2007, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by piercehawkeye45

Realistically, I wouldn't mind an Obama-Edwards duo since they seem to be at least on the same page.

But Merc, was that a joke or not? Can you explain?

It is my opinion that the popularity of these two people would be a force that could not be stopped in an election. Hitlery is already hugely popular, and Obama is running second, although not a close second, among many democratic voters.

piercehawkeye45 · 07-10-2007, 08:24 AM

So you think that those two can beat any two Republican candidates?

I'll agree that for overall popularity those two would make the strongest offense for the Democrats since most of the supporters I have seen seem to either be Hilary supporters, Obama supporters, or anti-Republicans and that team fits all three. Besides, Edwards is pretty close to Obama on issues so the Edwards supporters would most likely go with him.

While I agree that I think those two together would win the presidential election, assuming not much changes, because of the one-sidedness of the Republican party. Besides Ron Paul and a minute difference here or there, Giuliani’s social issues, they all seem to be on the exact same page and from what I have seen, their fan base isn't as split or determined as the Democrats.

Urbane Guerrilla · 07-11-2007, 02:00 AM

I think it's far more important that the nation win the War than that any Democrat win any office whatsoever. They haven't been selling anything I want since 1992.

07-08-2007, 08:13 PM	#1
richlevy King Of Wishful Thinking Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Philadelphia Suburbs Posts: 6,669	The Current Crop of Candidates After the fiasco of the last two elections, I have been holding out hope that the next election will be an 'issues' debate between two experienced and intelligent candidates with broad support within both parties. Instead of a 'lesser of two evils approach, to be presented with a difficult choice between two candidates, either of which I believed to be a suitable candidate. I just seem to get the impression that the most substantive candidates seem to be the 2nd tier in both parties. I think Hillary is smart, but I think she has a polarizing effect. I really like Richardson on paper, and so far he has not disappointed me, but as with all 2nd tier candidates, the question becomes would he change if he moved up to the 1st tier. Obama talks a great game, but so did GWB to his party faithful. I just would like to see a longer Obama resume. McCain has been a disappointment ever since he derailed the 'straight talk express' and became another politician selling himself for the prize. Romney and Guliani seem to be trying to reinvent themselves every minute. Fred Thompson is wisely keeping his mouth shut, which automatically makes him a viable candidate. I heard that appearance aside, he was a "gentleman's C" kind of legislator, putting in a fair but unremarkable effort and carrying a light to modest workload. Obama really does appear to be the 'take me as I am candidate'. My issue with him is the great unknown. He spoke out against the war, but he wasn't in Congress at the time and he was speaking as a private citizen, not as someone who had to make a real decision on incomplete (and now known to be faulty) information. I'm hoping that the 2nd tier can hang around in reserve for a while. If I could pick my own nominating debates, it would be Richardson against Hillary for the Democrats and between Ron Paul (or Tom Tancredo) against Mike Huckabee for the Republican nomination. I'm almost sorry Cheney isn't running. I'd like to see conservatives like Paul or Tancredo rip into him for pretty much everything he's done. __________________ Exercise your rights and remember your obligations - VOTE! I have always believed that hope is that stubborn thing inside us that insists, despite all the evidence to the contrary, that something better awaits us so long as we have the courage to keep reaching, to keep working, to keep fighting. -- Barack Hussein Obama

07-09-2007, 08:46 AM	#7
Rexmons - Kavkaz United - Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 613	I'd vote for him [Obama] but i think it would be useless due to the millions of Red Staters that would rather have a white devil in office than a black saint. Unless of course Dubya has actually left such a bad taste in their mouths as well, that they'll vote as far away from his type as possible. :fingerscrossed: __________________ "Life's a bitch but God forbid the bitch divorce me..."

07-09-2007, 10:14 AM	#8
skysidhe ~~Life is either a daring adventure or nothing.~~ Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 6,828	Seems like we all pretty much second your opinions Rich. I would say the same things about the same canadates as you did. It's amazing the clarity regular american people come up with. What's wrong with politics these days? The fact we chose someone we would like to go have a beer with is quite disturbing. No wait. Al Gore won the popular vote. I keep forgetting. People better get out and vote to keep people like McCain,Rommney and Guliani out. Some of the lesser democrates don't even have a chance but the Rebublican spin machine is an evil tool. Last edited by skysidhe; 07-09-2007 at 10:20 AM. Reason: adding stuff

07-09-2007, 08:38 PM	#9
TheMercenary “Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo” Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Savannah, Georgia Posts: 21,393	Hitlery with Obama as the VP would be un-stoppable.... Right that down. __________________ Anyone but the this most fuked up President in History in 2012!

07-11-2007, 02:00 AM	#15
Urbane Guerrilla Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 6,674	I think it's far more important that the nation win the War than that any Democrat win any office whatsoever. They haven't been selling anything I want since 1992. __________________ Wanna stop school shootings? End Gun-Free Zones, of course.

07-08-2007, 10:15 PM	#4
yesman065 Banned - Self Imposed Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,847	Further proof that hope springs eternal! I'm right there with you Rich, although a bit more skeptical.

07-10-2007, 12:26 AM	#11
piercehawkeye45 Franklin Pierce Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,695	Realistically, I wouldn't mind an Obama-Edwards duo since they seem to be at least on the same page. But Merc, was that a joke or not? Can you explain?

07-10-2007, 08:24 AM	#14
piercehawkeye45 Franklin Pierce Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,695	So you think that those two can beat any two Republican candidates? I'll agree that for overall popularity those two would make the strongest offense for the Democrats since most of the supporters I have seen seem to either be Hilary supporters, Obama supporters, or anti-Republicans and that team fits all three. Besides, Edwards is pretty close to Obama on issues so the Edwards supporters would most likely go with him. While I agree that I think those two together would win the presidential election, assuming not much changes, because of the one-sidedness of the Republican party. Besides Ron Paul and a minute difference here or there, Giuliani’s social issues, they all seem to be on the exact same page and from what I have seen, their fan base isn't as split or determined as the Democrats.

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