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Old 12-27-2008, 11:03 AM   #1
TheMercenary
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I understand your point but the reality is that many of the freedoms we enjoy allowed us to be vulnerable. Many of our freedoms are our source of weakness. Unless you live where you have the real threat of death and destruction you can't understand the need for heightened security actions. I don't like it either but it is a new fact of life. Life after the attacks on 9/11 in this country will never be the same and that is a fact we will all just have to get use to living with.
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Old 12-27-2008, 01:32 PM   #2
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I think it's quite the opposite... you notice the pat-down at the airport because it's a change. The restrictions on your freedom that have been there all along? Not noticed.

You could skip the airport pat-down by going there nude, but you'd be arrested. Why? You haven't done anything to anyone else. Other people are offended, but they don't have a right not to be offended.

Before the pat-down, you were still subject to marginally constitutional requirements in order to fly. Very few people objected. Penn Jillette used to carry a business card-sized bill of rights, engraved in bronze, in his shirt pocket when going through airport security. When asked to remove whatever metallic object was causing the metal detector to go off, he would take out the bronze card, hand it over, and say something like "I'm giving up my rights in order to get on this airplane."

The loss and gain of rights changes over time, but it's nice to remember that we gain rights without noticing. There was a time when it was considered obscene to air the sound of a toilet flush over the radio. There was a time when it was illegal to brew your own beer. You still can't hunt or fish in many places without a license. Gun rights? There's a tough one.

The pat-down is minor to me in comparison.
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Old 12-27-2008, 02:58 PM   #3
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plus.....you like it. perv
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Old 12-27-2008, 03:27 PM   #4
Sundae
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Hmmm.

We don't have "rights" like you do.
We had to have a passport to fly to NI, despite it being part of the UK, pre 9/11.
We had the Blitz, the Troubles and the Lockerbie bombing to deal with, way before merkins got scared.

We don't have a "Get over it" culture as we're far to the left of the US. But we do have a "Get on with things!" culture, especially as regards to unnatural disasters. You want to hurt us? Fuck you - join the queue. We were a target pre-Claudius, and out last conqueror was William the Bastard. We were here when you rose, we will be here when you fall.
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Old 12-27-2008, 03:56 PM   #5
TheMercenary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundae Girl View Post
Hmmm.

We don't have "rights" like you do.
We had to have a passport to fly to NI, despite it being part of the UK, pre 9/11.
We had the Blitz, the Troubles and the Lockerbie bombing to deal with, way before merkins got scared.

We don't have a "Get over it" culture as we're far to the left of the US. But we do have a "Get on with things!" culture, especially as regards to unnatural disasters. You want to hurt us? Fuck you - join the queue. We were a target pre-Claudius, and out last conqueror was William the Bastard. We were here when you rose, we will be here when you fall.
Oh, we will be here as well. I doubt we will fall. But since we have not had to endure much of the strife at home like you guy have over many years, we will have to get use to changes in the way things are done and compromise to remain safe.
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Old 12-27-2008, 04:53 PM   #6
Flint
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMercenary View Post
...we will have to get use to changes in the way things are done and compromise to remain safe.
I don't think that very many people have a problem with measures that would actually make us safer.
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Old 12-27-2008, 09:54 PM   #7
TheMercenary
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Originally Posted by Flint View Post
I don't think that very many people have a problem with measures that would actually make us safer.
I am glad you agree. Many of the actions taken have made us safer. Good to see us agree.
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Old 12-27-2008, 06:59 PM   #8
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Of course they do. Nobody has a fuckin' clue what keeps us safer, including you.

Imagine if Bush came on television on 9/10/2001, and said that due to remarkable intelligence received about threats to the country, we would be searching every single non-American air passenger for the next month as well as every Islamic American, immediately stopping all overseas flights for a week, invading an as-yet unnamed country in the Middle East, creating a new Homeland Security agency and developing coordinated intelligence between CIA, FBI and Military.

You woulda screamed bloody murder, along with everybody else: Chimpy and his evil minions are LYING COCKSUCKERS! Bent on creating a horrific story in order to build their own new focus of executive power!
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Old 12-29-2008, 03:26 PM   #9
Flint
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Originally Posted by Undertoad View Post
Nobody has a fuckin' clue what keeps us safer, including you.
I suspect that it's not: taking my shoes off, or jamming 3 oz toiletries into a 1 qt ziploc.
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There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there
it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your
expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever
gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio
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Old 12-29-2008, 03:27 PM   #10
TheMercenary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flint View Post
I suspect that it's not taking my shoes off, or jamming 3 oz toiletries into a 1 qt ziploc.
you are funny as hell. Of course you don't get any of this.
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Old 12-27-2008, 09:05 PM   #11
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Yes. And I say the same now.
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Old 12-27-2008, 09:56 PM   #12
TheMercenary
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Yes. And I say the same now.
There is no doubt in my mind that people like you exist. And that is ok. The rest of us will do the work.
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Old 12-28-2008, 07:49 AM   #13
Pie
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There is no doubt in my mind that people like you exist. And that is ok. The rest of us will do the work.
And I will lawfully resist you and your type to the best of my abilities.
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The fun thing about evolution (and science in general) is that it happens whether you believe in it or not.
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Old 12-27-2008, 09:35 PM   #14
footfootfoot
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Well Pie, ask him for a swig of his koolaid and see if you still feel the same way in a little while...
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Old 12-27-2008, 10:08 PM   #15
footfootfoot
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Read what these firefighters and EMTs have to say. THEY were there.
http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evid...xplosions.html
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