Narcissistic Personality Disorder (a novella, sorry)

[sexobon]

Q: How many psychologists does it take to change a light bulb?

A: Well, it only takes one psychologist; but, the lightbulb has to really want to change.

I cut my losses until they want to change; then, when they do I'm there for them. Life's too short to waste on some of the agonistic free wills out there.

[orthodoc]

All of those. People in the first circle of those close to you, who get the chance over years and years to do real damage, and who do so with focus and deliberation.

It took years for me to learn that protecting myself doesn't mean I'm harming the narcissist. So far, among the narcissists I have had the misfortune to know/be related to, none have any intention of changing anything. So I keep my distance and try to fend off the FOG (fear-obligation-guilt) that wafts my way during attempts by these people to re-engage in old behavior patterns.

[it]

Originally Posted by orthodoc

All of those. People in the first circle of those close to you, who get the chance over years and years to do real damage, and who do so with focus and deliberation.

Doesn't it makes you wonder though?

Naturally there are going to be more people who have someone with NPD in their circles then people with NPD, but would the number of victims of narcissistic abuse still add up to a realistic number of people with NPD?

How much of this is attribution error or simply positional, resulting from their position, the dynamic you are in or your perspective on it, rather then inherit to who they are? Are they - in their own life bubble far far away - having the same conversation about you? Each a case of two people fighting and kicking each other but too blinded to see the bruises on the other to realize their own bruises are part of a larger picture they've become blind too?
What if we're all just part of the same endless forest of people who are too close to each other to see beyond their own treetops, everyone writing stories where they are the hero or the victim but never the bad guy, everyone been too self righteous to see their part in what they inflict on others or their own damaging behavior to see the other by the same standards?

[monster]

[sexobon]

[limey]

So glad you've found a better gig, Toad. x

[Griff]

Originally Posted by limey

So glad you've found a better gig, Toad. x

Right there is the bottom line.

[Undertoad]

Thanks you guys. New gig begins today. You never know what you're gonna get.

~

This morning I was remembering what I mentioned to J about NPD: my ex had a touch of it too, although much less than this guy. She was a 7 where he was a 10.

One night my ex and I were walking down the Ocean City, MD boardwalk, a September night, filled with people; and she said to me,

I think I'm better than all these people.

I took it more as a statement about the averageness of the OC crowd, their habits and tastes, but it was really her own belief of her superiority as a human being.

You want there to be a hint of self-awareness and that's where the "I think" comes in; and the statement in and of itself. My boss would not have said it, just kept it in his head; and if he did say it, he wouldn't have said "I think".

And you want it to be a confession: "I think I'm better than all these people but I have come to the realization that I am pretty much the same, in the things that really matter." But it wasn't at all a confession.

And you want me to say to her some nugget of wisdom that frames the statement; but we are in our early 30s in this story, so there is no wisdom to be found. All I do is keep walking and think well maybe that is the case, she's very impressive and I am lucky to be married to someone very impressive.

And she is unable to make an emotional connection, that big NPD bullet point. Which in turn means she does not contain desire -- which in turn, leaves her with zero passion -- which in turn, means she was simply horrible in bed. Without having done the actual survey work, I'd say she was one of the worst lays on the Ocean City, MD boardwalk.

There's that nugget of wisdom.

[Undertoad]

Well that's a thread-killing observation eh?

[lumberjim]

not really, no

[xoxoxoBruce]

Everybody's ex is whacko in one way or another. In your case, you're fortunate to understand what pigeon hole she should be in, but that didn't help much, except maybe keep you sane. Just be thankful she had great tits and you're now away from the crazy.

The thread pause is, we were waiting with abated breath, for reports from the new gig. The Champagne and tarts welcoming breakfast, the second day promotion, the incredible sexy personal secretary, stuff like that.

[BigV]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Everybody's ex is whacko in one way or another. In your case, you're fortunate to understand what pigeon hole she should be in, but that didn't help much, except maybe keep you sane. Just be thankful she had great tits and you're now away from the crazy.

The thread pause is, we were waiting with abated breath, for reports from the new gig. The Champagne and tarts welcoming breakfast, the second day promotion, the incredible sexy personal secretary, stuff like that.

this is not drift, this is sabotage. Let's keep talking about UT's situation, not mine, okey?



:wink:

[xoxoxoBruce]

Heh heh heh.

[it]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Everybody's ex is whacko in one way or another.

...Are there people with ex's who aren't themselves people's ex's? Doesn't that just mean everyone is a whacko? If not innately, then at least after a relationship...

Personally, at least one of my ex's can be so sane and reasonable most of the time that it's almost a form of insanity on it's own right.
As far as the other one goes - I sometimes wish she was a psychopath. A psychopath will stab you once because you are in their way, a narcissist will then stab you again and again for bleeding offensively in a way that implies they could ever stab someone in the first place, then bury you alive but bleeding to muffle the noises.

I say "can" for a reason though - she can also be far from it - but there is nothing within the realm of sanity that is deprived of her. However, "can be sane" can not be said of the other one - There are fundamental human emotional capacities she is not really capable of. It took me a long time to acknowledge it about her, and when I did I still used to fantasize that any moment she'd rise to the occasion and prove it all wrong and make it all go away. Obviously, that never happened.

I think "can" is a good measuring stick - kind of like the difference between the concepts of positive liberty and negative liberty, but for sanity. This is part of why I cringe whenever someone argues in favor of trigger words for PTSD - I've been diagnosed with PTSD with a 1st and 2nd opinion agreeing obnoxiously, but I just learned to treat panic attacks and flashbacks as part of life, the idea that I should run away from it and let it handicap me... I hate that approach.




P.S.
I am counting 7 possible discussion drifting direction points above, hopefully they'll cancel each other out. Quick, someone say something positively supporting and encouraging to Toad. Or I'll do it.. With the power of emotes.

*LOOKS AT TOAD*
*ENCOURAGE*
*ENCOURAGE*
*ENCOURAGE*
*ENCOURAGE*

Did that work?

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by traceur

...Are there people with ex's who aren't themselves people's ex's? Doesn't that just mean everyone is a whacko? If not innately, then at least after a relationship...

Yes.