*Outdoor* Secondhand Smoke is a Hazard?

[tw]

Originally posted by slang
I really think this SHS issue is over rated. It's a tool to use against smokers.

Clearly you also think a shower (bathing) is overrated. I don't understand smelly drug addicts. But then I believe in being fair to my neighbors. Just because they like it means other's don't suffer. First indication of a self serving drug addict is my sinuses expand. Followed later by the smell. Then followed by a headache. But then that is my problem? Smokers are more important than anyone else.

How smelly are these drug addicts? I can even smell them from time to time as they drive past me - while on a bicycle! They smell that bad - and will often deny I can smell them. Just more symptoms of denial from drug addicts. Why do they even bother to take a shower?

NYCs ban on smoking has been working well. Non-smokers are now able to visit many restaurants and bars from which they were banned by nazi, drug addicted smokers. As in CA, it has meant about a 5% increase in businesses where self serving smokers once forced out all other customers.

Yes its all about what is fair. Smokers must first ask and obtain permission from everyone in that room and who will be in that room before they can smoke - if they are being fair. It smells worse that the worst fart in history. And unlike farts, it also creates health problems (long term) and headaches (short term).

But then smokers are also distinguished by another well proven fact - lower intelligence. Smokers have a lower intelligence (according to tests). Smoking is the need to temporaryily restore a drug addict's thinking ability - as even demonstrated by PET scans. That is what is we call addiction. A drug addict needs a cigarette just to restore thinking to normal levels. Why should they impose their addiction and body odors on everyone else? Low intelligence means no on else matters?

Shame on such drug addicts for claiming any rights. First they should fix themselves. The facts about smell and how it adversely affects others cannot be denied. But drug addicts will do so anyway. Denial is part of being an addict.

[elSicomoro]

I'll fix my habit when you fix your mental retardation.

[wolf]

He's also clearly never been exposed to geniune smelly drug addict ...

Had one tonight. SOOOO funky that the doctor came into the office and told me that I had to go and experience the level of extreme stank. It was indeed one of the more intense and amazing such experiences ... nose hairs catching fire kinda yucky. The lobby still reeked of his presence an hour after he had been removed from the area and the Air King™ was plugged in.

Exposure to such things builds up your resistance. You have to develop an immunity. It's the overconcerned, overcleaned, HEPA-filtered world we're in, IMHO, that's resulting in an increase in allergies, asthma, etc.

[tw]

Unrelated to the original topic - ever have a human come in smelling so bad that someone on staff actually vomitted? Now that would be a benchmark for bad.

Asthma - a new reason for the increase in asthma was recently cited in a research paper. When children are given too much antibiotics, especially the broad spectrum type, then there is a strong corrolation to asthma later in life. Apparent too many antibiotics to young kids causes immune disorders later in life. Maybe a reason why we don't want the kitchen floor so clean constantly?

[wolf]

Originally posted by tw
Unrelated to the original topic - ever have a human come in smelling so bad that someone on staff actually vomitted? Now that would be a benchmark for bad.

Yes, but she was pregnant, and might not actually count for the purposes of your question.

If someone stinks THAT bad my department has several solutions.

1. Breathe through your mouth. This doesn't really work.

2. Limit actual contact. Talk to patient through the closed door if necessary. When your eyes start watering, the interview is over.

3. Rub a bit of orange essential oil in your nostrils. This stuff replaces the scent of stinky homeless guy with that of Florida-fresh oranges. Extends amount of time you can spend with patient. You may recall simliar usage of Vicks Vap-O-Rub from Silence of the Lambs. This also works, but the smell of Vicks is horrendous on it's own AND you have those white smears under your nose you can't get rid of easily.

(Crap, that reminds me. We have to hide the orange oile from the accredidation surveyors that are coming next monday because I bought it at a new age store and we can't get a Materials Safety Data Sheet for it ...)

[tw]

Material Safety Data Sheet: the only time I needed it - and quickly - no body could find it.

Of course the most toxic substance in many building can be the human. How come those perfumed human don't require the equivalent of a MSDS? Oh, and cigarettes. Where is the MSDS for them?

[FileNotFound]

Originally posted by tw
Unrelated to the original topic - ever have a human come in smelling so bad that someone on staff actually vomitted? Now that would be a benchmark for bad.

Actually...once when I was taking SEPTA to college this filthy homeless bum got on. (50% of the time they're piss soaked& shit stained. At times I wonder if they do it on purpose. It can't be hard to get clothing washed.)

I swear, he stank so bad it made my eyes watery and I felt as if the skin inside my nose and throad was burning. Everyone shifted away from him and then when the train got moving he stumbled and pretty much wraped himself around a nicley dressed thirty yearold or so business woman. He pushed himself off her, appologized, by that point her face was green, and she had some filthy stains on her...she just stood there for about a minute and them threw up all over the doors...looked like she had kellogs for breakfast...then she began to cry.

I wasn't sure who I felt more sorry for....the bum or the woman...

[russotto]

http://www.pdmchemicals.com/MSDS/MSDS-Orange%20Oil.doc

Of course, an MSDS can make water look scary.

[Lady Sidhe]

Yeah, yeah, everyone bitches about second-hand smoke, but I don't see them leaving behind their cars and trucks and walking to work. I'm a smoker, but I don't particularly enjoy gas or diesel fumes...but I have to tolerate them, even though they pose a risk to my health (regardless of whether I smoke or not). I don't hear the anti-smokers bitching about non-cigarette related toxic fumes....

And I agree that the government should get over the extreme hiking of prices for cigarettes. It costs almost five dollars a pack for cigarettes, and LESS than five dollars for a six-pack of beer or a small bottle of liquor. What's up with THAT? Seems like the government is saying. "We don't want you to kill yourself slowly. We want you do do it quickly, and if possible, take as many people with you as you can."

While I smoke, I do not drink. However, I don't make it my life's work to villainize all drinkers. Yet, the same people who bitch about us cigarette smokers are the ones who go out on the weekends and get plastered, putting everyone else on the road with them at risk. I have only one thing to say to these people: I can smoke and drive without killing anyone.

Lady Sidhe

[Lady Sidhe]

Actually, research has shown that drinking coffee and/or smoking cigarettes increases ANYone's mental faculties in the short-term. It is not a permanent effect, and thus intelligence does not go up or down, despite TW's claims. This was a big thing when I was taking my psychopharmacology class (I have degrees in psych and CJ, not that they've done me a whole lot of good in the job market *grin*).

Anyway,what the most recent research has shown is that when a person smokes a cigarette, or drinks a cup of coffee, they do better on tasks that require quick thinking and alertness. It has nothing to do with native intelligence, IQ, or the lack thereof. It is a broad-spectrum effect on the brain (alertness) caused by the chemicals caffiene and nicotine.


Lady Sidhe

[tw]

Originally posted by Lady Sidhe
Actually, research has shown that drinking coffee and/or smoking cigarettes increases ANYone's mental faculties in the short-term. It is not a permanent effect, and thus intelligence does not go up or down, despite TW's claims. ...

Anyway,what the most recent research has shown is that when a person smokes a cigarette, or drinks a cup of coffee, they do better on tasks that require quick thinking and alertness. It has nothing to do with native intelligence, IQ, or the lack thereof. It is a broad-spectrum effect on the brain (alertness) caused by the chemicals caffiene and nicotine.

Now lets add the rest of the facts. When a smoker first starts smoking, his mental activity goes from normal to high. But because he is addicted, his overall mental abilities drop over time - as the addiction continues. It explains why smokers routinely have lower SAT scores. A smoker must keep smoking incessently just to maintain a normal mental activity level. That is fact proven by studies using Positron Emmission Tomology (PET) scans.

Coffee, on the other hand, is not a dangerous drug. It does not appear on the list of addictive drugs. And it does not cause an overall diminishing of intelligence levels. Coffee drinkers typically go from normal mental activity levels to accelerated levels. Unlike cigarette addicts, many coffee drinkers don't suffer long term diminished intellectual abilities. Of course, coffee is a powerful drug. Just does not diminish overall mental abilities as cigarettes do. Furthermore, coffee drinkers don't make adjacent non-addicts physically ill.

They stuck me in a hotel room in the smoking section. I did not notice until I was suffering the typical 'someone in the area is smoking' headache. Desk told me they put me there because they had no non-smoking rooms. A problem when one checks in late. Next week I got a non-smoking room. Got a headache. Went out to the hall and smelled the drug addicts. Hotel staff immediately discovered smokers in a non-smoking room about 3 doors down. Smokers are that evil because they smell that bad and because they make non-addicts physically ill. That they have diminished mental abilities - that is their problem. And diminished mental abilities are their problem.

It is a problem especially for smokers who were addicted before 18. Something like over 90% in this group cannot quit. It is a problem we all must admit to - and let the Aprils, et al of this world learn. In the meantime, smokers have this elephant on their back and must take special considerations to protect the rights of others - because they are addicts.

[Hubris Boy]

Originally posted by wolf


Breathe through your mouth.

Don't make me come over there.

[Lady Sidhe]

>>Now lets add the rest of the facts. When a smoker first starts smoking, his mental activity goes from normal to high. But because he is addicted, his overall mental abilities drop over time - as the addiction continues. It explains why smokers routinely have lower SAT scores.


If that's true, then why was I Dean't List throughout 8 years of college? I took all honors classes, got an honors degree, have two degrees (Psych and CJ), and two minors (English and History). I took and passed Italian, Old English, and the history of the English Language (which involves learning to read and write phonetically, and learn the basics of Indo-European, Latin, Greek, Old High German, Old High French, Old English, and Middle English). I took several special-study classes on subjects such as The History of Ancient Rome, The History of the Middle Ages, violence and aggression, criminal psychology, and profiling, and passed them all with high scores. I graduated with two degrees, and a 3.62 gpa.

To be honest, I don't know any smokers who are below-average intelligence. Perhaps it's because I'm picky about the people I associate with, but all the smokers I know are highly intelligent, witty, and quick on their feet.

It seems to me that since the PC thing nowadays is AGAINST smokers, the studies would be skewed. Just as such drugs as prozac, which are touted as miracle drugs, were given high praise in clinical trials, but later found that they did BARELY better than sugar pills....It's all about what's popular, and about what people want, or need, to hear.

And caffiene IS an addictive drug, be it coffee or tea. Ever heard of a caffiene headache? There's a reason for that. The body reacts in a negative way when the drug is withdrawn, same as cigarettes and alcohol.


Sidhe

[wolf]

I know plenty of dirt stupid people who smoke.

I get out more than you ...

I also know more crazy people that smoke. It's not a myth that folks with schizophrenia have a higher ratio of smoker/nonsmoker than other psychiatric illnesses and persons who are not diagnosed.

Not all smokers are schizophrenics, but most schizophrenics smoke. (79% of the schizophrenic patient population according to the first study)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Abstract
http://www.med.umich.edu/niclab/rese...izophrenia.htm

[Lady Sidhe]

I worked in a psychiatric facility for almost three years. I worked with everyone from small children to adults, and I can offer up an opinion as to why all the crazy people smoke. They have nothing else to do. Ever been in a psych hospital? They're wretched, depressing places where people are warehoused like animals in a zoo. All they have to do is fight and smoke, and they do plenty of both.

Besides, the evidence indicates that schizophrenia is genetic...

Sidhe