Gas Prices: Who's to Blame? - Page 6

Radar · 06-24-2008, 10:01 AM

Oil companies have been purposely reducing the supply of gas in America by not running their refineries at full capacity. Speculators are jumping on this. The oil producing countries are not to blame. The price of a barrel of oil is the same number of drachmas it's ever been, but the dollar is weaker (thanks to George W. Bush's deficit spending to fund an illegal war), that people think the price per barrel is rising is going up. Increased demand from developing nations like China and India coupled with investors on wall street realizing they get a better return on oil than through stocks is making this price increase spiral out of control.

Every oil exec should be repeatedly kicked in the balls by each and every single person who has to fill up their tanks at these prices. This includes GWB.

I'm all for free markets, but not for market manipulation by artificially reducing the supply when demand is increasing merely to drive up profits. This is not capitalism. Nor are the plethora of government incentives and breaks given to oil companies.

On the news yesterday, they said if the government stopped allowing oil futures to be traded on Wall Street, the price of oil would drop down to $1.50/gallon within 1 month. This would be great, but I'd be against it anyway because I'm for free markets.

Personally, I see the high price of gas, the threat of global warming, and the fighting in the middle-east as the catalyst we need to finally get electric cars back in America and to stop oil companies and car companies from squashing this kind of technology. I see it as a time for us to finally stop using oil for fuel. The technology is already here. In fact if America legalized hemp, we'd have an unlimited, cheap, renewable source of energy that could replace 100% of our fossil fuel needs within 5 years and unlike corn, it doesn't require pesticides, doesn't erode the soil, and doesn't take food away from hungry people. We could save the corn to feed people and livestock.

glatt · 06-24-2008, 10:38 AM

Hemp?

I didn't see your post heading in that direction. Surprised me there.

I don't know much about hemp as a biofuel, but I do know that if hemp is planted for biofuel, then that will take up farmland that would otherwise be growing food. So yes, it will take food away from hungry people.

xoxoxoBruce · 06-24-2008, 10:43 AM

The advantage of hemp, is that it will grow in soil unsuitable for food production, without extensive water and chemical fertilizers. There is a lot of this land available.

classicman · 06-24-2008, 11:04 AM

I think it actually helps convert that land into something more suitable for producing food too. Although I could be wrong.

glatt · 06-24-2008, 11:06 AM

OK, but if you are a farmer, and you don't own any shitty land, you'll plant hemp in your good soil so you can make some biofuel money too. At least initially that's what will happen. Maybe there will be more competition later and hemp prices will be driven down as people with the poor soil start planting too, but that will take a little while while they ramp up their production and get their farm equipment in place, etc.

Flint · 06-24-2008, 11:48 AM

What's the disadvantage if it isn't grown exculsively on shitty land?

glatt · 06-24-2008, 12:01 PM

If it's grown on good land, it takes away from the other crops that could have been grown on that good land.

I'm not opposed to hemp. I just think that the claim that it will be great for food production is a bit of a stretch.

Flint · 06-24-2008, 12:35 PM

I don't understand what claim you're refuting.

Are you suggesting that the "fat cats" in the glamorous world of dirt farming will use hemp as a weapon to tighten their stranglehold on the economy, and further their agenda of world domination?

Madman · 06-24-2008, 03:26 PM

Me... It's all my fault.

I'm sorry... I voted for Bush.

glatt · 06-24-2008, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint

Are you suggesting that the "fat cats" in the glamorous world of dirt farming will use hemp as a weapon to tighten their stranglehold on the economy, and further their agenda of world domination?

Something like that. I'm hoping to bait you into telling me their secrets so I can get in on the action.

Actually I was referring to Radar's claim that hemp "doesn't take food away from hungry people. We could save the corn to feed people and livestock."

Flint · 06-24-2008, 03:38 PM

Well, I don't read the threads.

glatt · 06-24-2008, 03:49 PM

You just weave them together to make pretty macrame owls.

xoxoxoBruce · 06-24-2008, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glatt

If it's grown on good land, it takes away from the other crops that could have been grown on that good land.

I'm not opposed to hemp. I just think that the claim that it will be great for food production is a bit of a stretch.

Well, the people sneaking out and smoking that hemp, will get the munchies and increase the demand for food, which will cause an increase in production.

Radar · 06-25-2008, 12:09 PM

Historically farmers grew hemp between growing foods to strengthen and enrich the soil. Besides, what's wrong with using government owned land to grow hemp? The government allows mining companies, logging companies, etc. to use government land. Why not something as patriotic as helping America break away from foreign oil?

Also, hemp does not take food away from hungry people. Hemp is a source of food.

Clodfobble · 06-25-2008, 02:39 PM

Really? I've never heard that. How do you eat hemp? Like a typical green leaf, or does it need to be prepared in some way?

View Poll Results: Who is to blame for recent gas price increases?
Market speculators	14	40.00%
Oil companies	13	37.14%
Oil producing countries	8	22.86%
China	10	28.57%
US Automakers	9	25.71%
Lack of refining capacity	10	28.57%
US government/lawmakers	11	31.43%
The Federal Reserve	7	20.00%
Dark Markets	4	11.43%
TheMercenary	7	20.00%
US Consumers	12	34.29%
Other	13	37.14%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 35. You may not vote on this poll

06-24-2008, 10:01 AM	#76
Radar Constitutional Scholar Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Ocala, FL Posts: 4,006	Oil companies have been purposely reducing the supply of gas in America by not running their refineries at full capacity. Speculators are jumping on this. The oil producing countries are not to blame. The price of a barrel of oil is the same number of drachmas it's ever been, but the dollar is weaker (thanks to George W. Bush's deficit spending to fund an illegal war), that people think the price per barrel is rising is going up. Increased demand from developing nations like China and India coupled with investors on wall street realizing they get a better return on oil than through stocks is making this price increase spiral out of control. Every oil exec should be repeatedly kicked in the balls by each and every single person who has to fill up their tanks at these prices. This includes GWB. I'm all for free markets, but not for market manipulation by artificially reducing the supply when demand is increasing merely to drive up profits. This is not capitalism. Nor are the plethora of government incentives and breaks given to oil companies. On the news yesterday, they said if the government stopped allowing oil futures to be traded on Wall Street, the price of oil would drop down to $1.50/gallon within 1 month. This would be great, but I'd be against it anyway because I'm for free markets. Personally, I see the high price of gas, the threat of global warming, and the fighting in the middle-east as the catalyst we need to finally get electric cars back in America and to stop oil companies and car companies from squashing this kind of technology. I see it as a time for us to finally stop using oil for fuel. The technology is already here. In fact if America legalized hemp, we'd have an unlimited, cheap, renewable source of energy that could replace 100% of our fossil fuel needs within 5 years and unlike corn, it doesn't require pesticides, doesn't erode the soil, and doesn't take food away from hungry people. We could save the corn to feed people and livestock. __________________ "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." - George Carlin

06-24-2008, 10:43 AM	#78
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	The advantage of hemp, is that it will grow in soil unsuitable for food production, without extensive water and chemical fertilizers. There is a lot of this land available. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

06-24-2008, 11:04 AM	#79
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	I think it actually helps convert that land into something more suitable for producing food too. Although I could be wrong. __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

06-24-2008, 11:48 AM	#81
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	What's the disadvantage if it isn't grown exculsively on shitty land? __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

06-24-2008, 10:38 AM	#77
glatt ™ Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 27,717	Hemp? I didn't see your post heading in that direction. Surprised me there. I don't know much about hemp as a biofuel, but I do know that if hemp is planted for biofuel, then that will take up farmland that would otherwise be growing food. So yes, it will take food away from hungry people.

06-24-2008, 11:06 AM	#80
glatt ™ Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 27,717	OK, but if you are a farmer, and you don't own any shitty land, you'll plant hemp in your good soil so you can make some biofuel money too. At least initially that's what will happen. Maybe there will be more competition later and hemp prices will be driven down as people with the poor soil start planting too, but that will take a little while while they ramp up their production and get their farm equipment in place, etc.

06-24-2008, 12:01 PM	#82
glatt ™ Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 27,717	If it's grown on good land, it takes away from the other crops that could have been grown on that good land. I'm not opposed to hemp. I just think that the claim that it will be great for food production is a bit of a stretch.

06-24-2008, 12:35 PM	#83
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	I don't understand what claim you're refuting. Are you suggesting that the "fat cats" in the glamorous world of dirt farming will use hemp as a weapon to tighten their stranglehold on the economy, and further their agenda of world domination? __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

06-24-2008, 03:26 PM	#84
Madman has left the building. Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 455	Me... It's all my fault. I'm sorry... I voted for Bush.

06-24-2008, 03:38 PM	#86
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	Well, I don't read the threads. __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

06-24-2008, 03:49 PM	#87
glatt ™ Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 27,717	You just weave them together to make pretty macrame owls. Attached Images

06-25-2008, 12:09 PM	#89
Radar Constitutional Scholar Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Ocala, FL Posts: 4,006	Historically farmers grew hemp between growing foods to strengthen and enrich the soil. Besides, what's wrong with using government owned land to grow hemp? The government allows mining companies, logging companies, etc. to use government land. Why not something as patriotic as helping America break away from foreign oil? Also, hemp does not take food away from hungry people. Hemp is a source of food. __________________ "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." - George Carlin

06-25-2008, 02:39 PM	#90
Clodfobble UNDER CONDITIONAL MITIGATION Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 20,012	Really? I've never heard that. How do you eat hemp? Like a typical green leaf, or does it need to be prepared in some way?

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