6/30: Haze pollution

Undertoad · 06-30-2001, 10:44 AM

[IMG]pictures/newark1.jpg[/IMG]

Look closely at these two images and you see a difference. In the top image, you can see the NYC skyline in the background. In the bottom image, you can't. The city is gone!

These two shots were taken from a webcam in Newark, seven miles from that skyline, and they show the effect of haze.

Haze is a type of air pollution. Turns out that sulfur in fuels is released into the air as little particles. These particles then absorb water vapor and - this is the trick - grow to about the same size as the wavelength of visible light. So they scatter light into white murkiness, and that light doesn't reach your eyes. Thus, the city disappears.

All that noted, air pollution is much better today than it was 30 years ago.

serge · 06-30-2001, 11:14 AM

For a similar but more close up shot.. stand on the Bay Ridge (Brooklyn) pier (forget exact ave.).. you know the newly rebuilt one.. and look in the direction of Manhattan.

Chewbaccus · 06-30-2001, 12:02 PM

I'm sorry, when I saw that this was taken in Newark, it immediately lost all credibility.

We drive through Newark to get to NYC, because my mother is too reluctant to take anything but the turnpikes. There were times when we had to have our lights on because of all the stuff floating around there.

~Mike

elSicomoro · 06-30-2001, 01:03 PM

Another good image would be to look at the Philadelphia skyline from Cottman and I-95. In the morning, it looks pristine...but look at it at 2 in the afternoon and it's another story.

Another one of the very few nice things about Washington, DC--very little smog.

russotto · 06-30-2001, 07:04 PM

There's no smog in DC, but there's plenty of haze. "Hazy, hot, and humid" is standard summer weather there.

You can see it on a hot day out my way pretty easily -- there's several small ridges around, and they disappear into the haze. If I can't see the ridge between 202 and 30 when I go in to work, I know it's going to be viciously hot and humid!

jaguar · 06-30-2001, 11:17 PM

In 20 years ill sit back and laugh while all those american SUV driver hack out thier lungs. Pity the rest of you will be too....
Someone considered organsing a cityiwde surgical-mask day, kinda get the point accross, everyone wearings those. Better yet clean them all out at the end of the day, and pour all the crap into open windows on SUVs!!!!!

CyclopONE · 07-01-2001, 03:11 AM

If you drive north on I-55, going towards Chicago, you can see what kind of a day it's going to be by just looking at the downtown skyline. On clear cool days, I can see Sears Tower all the way from the suburban town of Darien. In the most haze fogged day, I can't see the tower until I get past Cicero avenue on I-55 and even then it's a dim ghost.

-Cyc

Slithy_Tove · 07-01-2001, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tony Shepps
All that noted, air pollution is much better today than it was 30 years ago.

Nationwide, that's true. There's a lot of local variation, though. LA, for example, is much better. Fast-growing cities like Las Vegas may be much worse. Driving into Vegas from the south, as you crest a range of low hills, you can see the city spread out below in the valley, half-obscured by a thick haze of pink smog. It's really pretty appalling. The Vegas metroropolitan area is, I believe, the fastest growing area in the nation. But they're really paying a price for that growth.

Washington D.C., as someone else noted, may be relatively smog-free. But that's because the growth rate is nil, or even negative, and there is little industry; the business of D.C. is government. Not everywhere can be like that.

Philadelphia, according to the last census, is in serious negative growth. Wonder how our pollution is doing?

elSicomoro · 07-01-2001, 01:45 PM

Cyc, that is one of my favorite skyline shots...rolling into Chicago on 55...I may have some shots I took from that vantage point...will have to dig around.

I miss Chicago

Russotto, as you pointed out, DC is indeed hot, hazy, and humid. (Except for last year...it was amazingly pleasant all summer...mid 80s, low humidity...ah!) The fact that Washington, DC has very little industry is a boost to that city's relative cleanliness (at least on Capitol Hill and in the Northwest).

Now, define negative growth, because that is a bit confusing to me...considering that we only lost 68,000 people overall from 1990-2000, well WELL below the original estimates. Is this the slow down or lack of growth in the region as a whole?

TheDollyLlama · 07-01-2001, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sycamore

Russotto, as you pointed out, DC is indeed hot, hazy, and humid. (Except for last year...it was amazingly pleasant all summer...mid 80s, low humidity...ah!) The fact that Washington, DC has very little industry is a boost to that city's relative cleanliness (at least on Capitol Hill and in the Northwest).

Indeed. DC has some of the most remarkable haze anywhere. Summer of 99, it was so bad I couldn't see across 200yds of river. More remarkable is that you claim DC has very little industry to produce this pollution, when it is clearly obvious the primary industry of the area is HOT AIR.

elSicomoro · 07-01-2001, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by TheDollyLlama
Indeed. DC has some of the most remarkable haze anywhere. Summer of 99, it was so bad I couldn't see across 200yds of river. More remarkable is that you claim DC has very little industry to produce this pollution, when it is clearly obvious the primary industry of the area is HOT AIR.

You mean the weather, or the politicians?

I do remember the summer of '99...yep, that was a mess...people in Maryland tattling on each other over water restrictions...heh.

TheDollyLlama · 07-02-2001, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sycamore

You mean the weather, or the politicians?

I do remember the summer of '99...yep, that was a mess...people in Maryland tattling on each other over water restrictions...heh.

Wouldn't know about the water restrictions. During my tenure at a certain govt funded prison^H^H^H^H^H^H college there in Maryland, we ran the showers on cold to cool the room down. I'm a bastard, aren't i?

jaguar · 07-02-2001, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sycamore

Russotto, as you pointed out, DC is indeed hot, hazy, and humid. (Except for last year...it was amazingly pleasant all summer...mid 80s, low humidity...ah!) The fact that Washington, DC has very little industry is a boost to that city's relative cleanliness (at least on Capitol Hill and in the Northwest).

And here was me htinking DC porduced more SHIT than the rest of the country put together...

CyclopONE · 07-02-2001, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sycamore
I miss Chicago

What do you miss most about Chicago? The food? The people? Wrigley Field?

-Cyc

elSicomoro · 07-02-2001, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaguar

And here was me htinking DC porduced more SHIT than the rest of the country put together...

Make no mistake Jag, Washington, DC is the unwiped a**hole of America (although it is running neck and neck with the state of New Jersey).

You would think that Washington, DC would be the nation's finest city, seeing as it is the capital of the free world. The truth is, Washington, DC has its nice parts. But the majority of the city is run-down, particularly the SE section of the city. NW DC and Capitol Hill are nice, but the cost of living there is astronomical. Not to mention, there are a large number of circles, which make driving a nightmarish hell.

06-30-2001, 10:44 AM	#1
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	6/30: Haze pollution [IMG]pictures/newark1.jpg[/IMG] Look closely at these two images and you see a difference. In the top image, you can see the NYC skyline in the background. In the bottom image, you can't. The city is gone! These two shots were taken from a webcam in Newark, seven miles from that skyline, and they show the effect of haze. Haze is a type of air pollution. Turns out that sulfur in fuels is released into the air as little particles. These particles then absorb water vapor and - this is the trick - grow to about the same size as the wavelength of visible light. So they scatter light into white murkiness, and that light doesn't reach your eyes. Thus, the city disappears. All that noted, air pollution is much better today than it was 30 years ago.

06-30-2001, 11:14 AM	#2
serge * Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 85	For a similar but more close up shot.. stand on the Bay Ridge (Brooklyn) pier (forget exact ave.).. you know the newly rebuilt one.. and look in the direction of Manhattan. __________________ Patriotism is for Losers

06-30-2001, 12:02 PM	#3
Chewbaccus Freethinker/booter Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 523	I'm sorry, when I saw that this was taken in Newark, it immediately lost all credibility. We drive through Newark to get to NYC, because my mother is too reluctant to take anything but the turnpikes. There were times when we had to have our lights on because of all the stuff floating around there. ~Mike __________________ Like the wise man said: Of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.

06-30-2001, 11:17 PM	#6
jaguar whig Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 5,075	In 20 years ill sit back and laugh while all those american SUV driver hack out thier lungs. Pity the rest of you will be too.... Someone considered organsing a cityiwde surgical-mask day, kinda get the point accross, everyone wearings those. Better yet clean them all out at the end of the day, and pour all the crap into open windows on SUVs!!!!! __________________ Good friends, good books and a sleepy conscience: this is the ideal life. - Twain

07-01-2001, 03:11 AM	#7
CyclopONE Regulator of Squalor Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Chicagoland Posts: 37	One for Chicago If you drive north on I-55, going towards Chicago, you can see what kind of a day it's going to be by just looking at the downtown skyline. On clear cool days, I can see Sears Tower all the way from the suburban town of Darien. In the most haze fogged day, I can't see the tower until I get past Cicero avenue on I-55 and even then it's a dim ghost. -Cyc __________________ On a clear disk, you can seek forever.

06-30-2001, 01:03 PM	#4
elSicomoro Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 12,486	Another good image would be to look at the Philadelphia skyline from Cottman and I-95. In the morning, it looks pristine...but look at it at 2 in the afternoon and it's another story. Another one of the very few nice things about Washington, DC--very little smog.

06-30-2001, 07:04 PM	#5
russotto Professor Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 1,788	There's no smog in DC, but there's plenty of haze. "Hazy, hot, and humid" is standard summer weather there. You can see it on a hot day out my way pretty easily -- there's several small ridges around, and they disappear into the haze. If I can't see the ridge between 202 and 30 when I go in to work, I know it's going to be viciously hot and humid!

07-01-2001, 01:45 PM	#9
elSicomoro Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 12,486	Cyc, that is one of my favorite skyline shots...rolling into Chicago on 55...I may have some shots I took from that vantage point...will have to dig around. I miss Chicago Russotto, as you pointed out, DC is indeed hot, hazy, and humid. (Except for last year...it was amazingly pleasant all summer...mid 80s, low humidity...ah!) The fact that Washington, DC has very little industry is a boost to that city's relative cleanliness (at least on Capitol Hill and in the Northwest). Now, define negative growth, because that is a bit confusing to me...considering that we only lost 68,000 people overall from 1990-2000, well WELL below the original estimates. Is this the slow down or lack of growth in the region as a whole?

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