Talk about the Marichiko ban here

[Undertoad]

Part of my intent was to prevent the tobacco thread from being ruined by the controversy.

I suppose I should have just let the original thread be ruined. Although its creator had PMd me specifically to ask where a tobacco thread should go and whether or not it would be ruined, and posted in the first message that he hoped it woudn't be ruined.

I should not have attempted to be stylish ("must... not... ruin thread") when suggesting to LJ that there would be a better place for the discussion of Mari smoking. This increased the chances that people would misinterpret me.

When trying vainly to discuss the complete idiocy of a CO-poisoned person smoking, I should have removed the personal aspect by discussing it as if there was some non-involved person I was dealing with.

I should have known that calling Mari an idiot would result in her total spazzing out in order to get even more and bloodier attention.

I should never EVER have taken the resulting bait.

I do, however, stand by my words on the matter. It was not mean of me to prevent the original thread from being ruined. It was not mean of me to start a thread to discuss the matter. It was mean of me to call her an idiot, but that meanness is called-for.

Tonch your instinctive reaction is to post a long message because - oh my ghod they're attacking her and they could well be attacking me! - but you are an entirely different being, despite the fact that your circumstances have some similarities. I am kind of thinking that if you knew that smoking aggravated your condition, if you knew that it might put you back on that table and redouble your expenses, you, like, wouldn't do it.

Evidence: smoking would totally aggravate your condition, and thus you don't smoke. Right?

But if ya did, should we pat you on the back for it, or slap you in the face? Or should we just ignore you, if we have nothing but contempt for what you say.

I don't know. But I prefer honesty to coddling.

(P.S. And how mean is it really, to give a Borderline Personality negative attention? That's what they wanted in the first place. That's why they are here. The whole thing is a farce and frankly you are falling for it... just like I did.)

[Beestie]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

The whole thing is a farce and frankly you are falling for it... just like I did.)

I give LJ some credit here because I recall he was the first one to "go public" that Mari was a fraud. And I don't think anyone owes anyone an apology for not putting up with it.

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Part of my intent was to prevent the tobacco thread from being ruined by the controversy.

I suppose I should have just let the original thread be ruined. Although its creator had PMd me specifically to ask where a tobacco thread should go and whether or not it would be ruined, and posted in the first message that he hoped it woudn't be ruined.

I should not have attempted to be stylish ("must... not... ruin thread") when suggesting to LJ that there would be a better place for the discussion of Mari smoking. This increased the chances that people would misinterpret me.

When trying vainly to discuss the complete idiocy of a CO-poisoned person smoking, I should have removed the personal aspect by discussing it as if there was some non-involved person I was dealing with.

I should have known that calling Mari an idiot would result in her total spazzing out in order to get even more and bloodier attention.

I should never EVER have taken the resulting bait.

I do, however, stand by my words on the matter. It was not mean of me to prevent the original thread from being ruined. It was not mean of me to start a thread to discuss the matter. It was mean of me to call her an idiot, but that meanness is called-for.

Tonch your instinctive reaction is to post a long message because - oh my ghod they're attacking her and they could well be attacking me! - but you are an entirely different being, despite the fact that your circumstances have some similarities. I am kind of thinking that if you knew that smoking aggravated your condition, if you knew that it might put you back on that table and redouble your expenses, you, like, wouldn't do it.

Evidence: smoking would totally aggravate your condition, and thus you don't smoke. Right?

But if ya did, should we pat you on the back for it, or slap you in the face? Or should we just ignore you, if we have nothing but contempt for what you say.

I don't know. But I prefer honesty to coddling.

(P.S. And how mean is it really, to give a Borderline Personality negative attention? That's what they wanted in the first place. That's why they are here. The whole thing is a farce and frankly you are falling for it... just like I did.)

I sure as hell did and it did kill my thread. Which could have been a nice thread. Someone with her professed condition has no business inhaling smoke.
This whole thing got so blown out of proportion, but at the same time it seems that is has been coming for a long time and has been a purge of sorts.
Unfortunately, I doubt that anyone will get to the true bottom of the story.

[Tonchi]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Tonch your instinctive reaction is to post a long message because - oh my ghod they're attacking her and they could well be attacking me! - but you are an entirely different being, despite the fact that your circumstances have some similarities. I am kind of thinking that if you knew that smoking aggravated your condition, if you knew that it might put you back on that table and redouble your expenses, you, like, wouldn't do it.

No, my instinctive reaction is to defend my friends. I don't defend what they DO, I defend THEM, based on whether or not they are being treated fairly. Do not misunderstand, I believe YOU were correct and I said so right out front. And believe me, Mari is going to hear plenty from me about that smoking, if for no other reason that it will prevent me from ever visiting her because my lungs seize up when there is cigarette smoke around. Darn right I know better than to smoke; although my dad was a tobacco broker I have never smoked a cigarette in my life, and yet I still have permanent lung damage as a result of heavy exposure to second-hand smoke from the day I was born. My posting had nothing whatever to do with justifying my own existence or condition by justifying Mari. I was only trying to show that extraordinary problems in one's life lead to often completely different responses, that everybody has to find their own ways of dealing with it, and especially, that conditions which restrict oxygen to your brain can severely limit your ability to carry on normally. I do not think that you, UT were being "mean" to her, what I am saying is that as an Administrator, whom I admire greatly, I believe it was inappropriate to single out another member for attack by your own initative. I have caught myself doing that before on my other forum and regretted it, it's rather like if the Alpha Dog takes the first bite it psychologically justifies the slaughter that follows so the frenzy is even greater in the pack. It didn't "feel right", no matter what the justification, you are too noble to let yourself be dragged in to something like this.


To LJ: That was no diatribe, my dear. To write a diatribe you have to be freshly angry and my ability to sit down and react to every post I see is greatly limited. It allows me to think about what I say, an indulgence which you seem to rarely have. I wasn't with you right out of the gate because it took me more than a week to even FIND this thread since it was in a forum which I did not know had been created. The computer time I can put in has to be dedicated primarily to my work at another website, where they are counting on me to be there even if I am only able to stand and page through all the hundreds of posts per day until my 2am shift is over. When it takes 2 days of standing/walking/sitting to get what you feel onto a page, it allows you to net it out and say what needs to be said. I NEED to defend somebody who, yes, I believe does not have a mean bone in their body. How and why I believe that is based on my personal knowledge and experience with her, just like my personal experience with you has convinced me that you play with your dick too much. I did not insult or attack anybody by giving my opinion, did you believe yours was the only opinion allowed? You believe you are justified in attacking Mari on the fine points, and why shouldn't you? That is totally your right. If somebody can't post consistent statements, they have left themselves open to being both corrected and rejected. I knew before the first remark you ever made to me here that unless you thought I was a 5' 8" nympho with a 40" bustline and blond hair past my waist, you were also going to treat me like shit. That doesn't worry me in the least. You are what you are, and The Cellar would not be nearly as interesting if we did not have all kinds. I cock you very much, and have a nice dick.


To Beestie: Thank you for your kind words, that was appreciated. I'll post a photo of the gunk they took out of me, it is gross enough to enchant little kids and CSI fans. The operation took 12 hours because they pack you in ice first to lower your body temp to about 60 before taking your heart and lungs offline and draining all the blood out of your arteries. Afterwards, they have to jump start you again and thaw you out and keep you in a coma for 24 hours to be sure the hypertension is dropping and you don't develop pneumonia. The procedure is called a Pulmonary Thromboendarterectomy and I was only the 1,910th person in the world it has been performed on. UCSD gave me a T-shirt which says that. It's a fascinating operation, I wish I could have stayed up to watch, like I did for the two heart caths they performed before it.