Welfare to kids of illegals in LA County costs $276 million per year

[Dagney]

It's a little difficult to put my fingers on 'current' statistics without revealing information about myself I'm not willing to share, however, this information is available on the web, and it provides concrete numbers of the situation of illegal immigration in Pennsylvania. (Statewide, not just in MaggieL's neighborhood, but mine as well). I can generate the same sort of information for a southern state as well, which has a much higher population and struggles even more because of lower tax income. However, for me, this is enough justification that the illegal alien population is draining my wallet.

ETA: And before you call me racist, I work with a number of people from all over the world, date someone who wasn't born in this country, and could care less what color your skin is. If you break the laws in my country, you should be punished. Period. No matter where you were born.

I will keep looking for more updated information to prove that it's only getting worse, it's not getting better.

Source http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServe...h_research652f




INS ESTIMATE

The INS estimated in February 2003 that the illegal alien population in Pennsylvania was 49,000 as of January 2000. That represented an increase of 12,000 illegal aliens from the previous INS estimate that as of October 1996 there were 37,000 illegal residents. The latter estimate was a 37 percent increase above the INS estimate for 1992 (27,000).
Only 19 states have larger numbers of illegal resident aliens than Pennsylvania, according to the current INS estimate.
Pennsylvania has received partial compensation under the federal State Criminal Alien Assistance Program (SCAAP) that was established in 1994 to compensate the states and local jurisdictions for incarceration of "undocumented," aliens who are serving time for a felony conviction or at least two misdemeanors.
ENFORCEMENT OPERATIONS

The INS cited deportations of 1,259 criminal aliens in Pennsylvania during FY'2000 as their primary focus for enforcement operations. They also removed 590 illegal aliens and were holding 1,560 aliens on Dec. 1, including 1,098 convicted of crimes. (Source: AP, Dec. 4, 2000)
INCARCERATION COSTS

The recent SCAAP amounts that Pennsylvania has received were:

FY’99—$5,151,511
FY’00—$4,306,272
FY’01—$2,273,565
FY’02—$2,683,207
FY’03—$1,266,741
FY’04—$1,693,912
The amount of SCAAP awards has been declining in both total distributions and even more as a share of the state’s expenses. In FY’99 the state received 38.6% of its costs for 539 prisoner years of detention. By FY’02, the state’s reported illegal alien detention rose by 19 percent to 640 prisoner years, while compensation fell by 48 percent and since has decreased sharply.
MEDICAL COSTS OF ILLEGAL ALIENS

Under the Emergency Medical Treatment and Labor Act, hospitals with emergency rooms are required to treat and stabilize patients with emergency medical needs regardless whether or not they are in the country legally or whether they are able to pay for the treatment. Congress in 2003 enacted an appropriation of $250 million per year (for 4 years) to help offset some of the costs due to use of this service by illegal aliens. This amount has been allocated among the states based upon estimates of the illegal alien population and data on the apprehension of illegal aliens in each state. This amount compensates only a fraction of the medical outlays. For Pennsylvania, the proposed payment in fiscal year 2004 is $1,168,499.

An additional link on Financial impact of Immigration (Not deliniated between Legal/Illegal, but still telling)
http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServe...searche251#msa

INS Statistics as of 2004 (Not broken down by states)
http://www.uscis.gov/graphics/shared...arbook2004.pdf

[MaggieL]

Comical.
Your sockpuppet act is so busted, Billy.

Like I said on the other thread, have a nice day

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by mjohncoady

You are certainly correct and I suspect that a large chunk of those billions in tax cuts ends up in the hands of the citizens of L.A. County. Send all of those horrible undocumented workers back home and save the $276 million. Our grandchildren's grandchildren will still be paying off the remaining billions of debt long after we have gone. The phrase is, I believe, penny-wise, pound foolish. It is, however, much easier to take candy from a baby than a BMW from a realtor or a stockbroker.

But it's our penny and pound, isn't it? And if we don't want to spend it on illegal aliens that's our right isn't it?
We take in more immigrants than the rest of the world combined and nobody can tell me we're bad for not accepting these criminals as well.

[billybob]

Originally Posted by Dagney

It's a little difficult to put my fingers on 'current' statistics without revealing information about myself I'm not willing to share, however, this information is available on the web, and it provides concrete numbers of the situation of illegal immigration in Pennsylvania.

Awesome, thanks Dagney. At last, someone who can provide figures rather than just blind prejudice. A debater.

So, do you think the US would be better off evicting these people en masse, or legalising those who are supporting themselves and benefitting from their labor and taxation?

[billybob]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

But it's our penny and pound, isn't it? And if we don't want to spend it on illegal aliens that's our right isn't it?
We take in more immigrants than the rest of the world combined ...........

It's your country's penny and your country's pound. If the US as a whole don't want to spend money on it, why did you re-elect a President who came in with an agenda to legalise and relax immigration?


http://www.washtimes.com/national/20...3424-5467r.htm

Could it be that your views are not in harmony with the majority?

[billybob]

Originally Posted by MaggieL

Comical.
Your sockpuppet act is so busted, Billy.

Like I said on the other thread, have a nice day

Post 29, MaggieL.....you have been offered the chance again to answer questions, are you running out on me now?

We now have an official strategy for dealing with illegals.Whine about mexicans in general, and run away when asked for details. Dagney has provided more facts in one post than you have offered in the entire thread.
Maybe you can learn from him, but I doubt it.

[Dagney]

Originally Posted by billybob

Awesome, thanks Dagney. At last, someone who can provide figures rather than just blind prejudice. A debater.

So, do you think the US would be better off evicting these people en masse, or legalising those who are supporting themselves and benefitting from their labor and taxation?

In regards to the topic at hand. It's theoretically impossible to evict 11 million illegals. However, I believe that a 'dent' can be made in the population by evicting them when they're located, not ignored. Traffic tickets, misdemeanors, arrests, any time an illegal is identified, they're on a plane and sent home, at their own cost. If they can't pay outright, we bill their country of origin.

Amnesty will not make the problem better - only worse. It's not an option to consider.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by billybob

It's your country's penny and your country's pound. If the US as a whole don't want to spend money on it, why did you re-elect a President who came in with an agenda to legalise and relax immigration?

Could it be that your views are not in harmony with the majority?

1- I didn't relect him, neither did a majority of the citizens.
2- I speak for nobody but me, harmony is the least of my concerns.

Here's another "not in harmony" citizen;

Dear Senator Frist:
There is a huge amount of propaganda and myths circulating about illegal aliens, particularly illegal Mexican, Salvadorian, Guatemalan and Honduran aliens.

1. Illegal aliens generally do NOT want U.S. citizenship. Americans are very vain thinking that everybody in the world wants to be a U.S. citizen. Mexicans, and other nationalities want to remain citizens of their home countries while obtaining the benefits offered by the United States such as employment, medical care, in-state tuition, government subsidized housing and free education for their offspring. Their main attraction is employment and their loyalty usually remains at home. They want benefits earned and subsidized by middle class Americans. What illegal aliens want are benefits of American residence without paying the price.

2. There are no jobs that Americans won't do. Illegal aliens are doing jobs that Americans can't take and still support their families. Illegal aliens take low wage jobs, live dozens in a single residence home, share expenses and send money to their home country. There are no jobs that Americans won't do for a decent wage.

3. Every person who illegally entered this nation left a home. They are NOT homeless and they are NOT Americans. Some left jobs in their home countries. They come to send money to their real home as evidenced by the more than 20 billion dollars sent out of the country each year by illegal aliens. These illegal aliens knowingly and willfully entered this nation in violation of the law and therefore assumed the risk of detection and deportation. Those who brought their alien children assumed the responsibility and risk on behalf of their children.

4. Illegal aliens are NOT critical to the economy. Illegal aliens constitute less than 5% of the workforce. However, they reduce wages and benefits for lawful U.S. residents.

5. This is NOT an immigrant nation. There are 280 million native born Americans. While it is true that this nation was settled and founded by immigrants (legal immigrants), it is also true that there is not a nation on this planet that was not settled by immigrants at one time or another.

6. The United States is welcoming to legal immigrants. Illegal aliens are not immigrants by definition. The U.S. accepts more lawful immigrants every year than the rest of the world combined.

7. There is no such thing as the "Hispanic vote". Hispanics are white, brown, black and every shade in between. Hispanics are Republicans, Democrats, Anarchists, Communists, Marxists and Independents. The so-called "Hispanic vote" is a myth. Pandering to illegal aliens to get the Hispanic vote is a dead end.

8. Mexico is NOT a friend of the United States. Since 1848 Mexicans have resented the United States. During World War I Mexico allowed German Spies to operate freely in Mexico to spy on the U.S. During World War II Mexico allowed the Axis powers to spy on the U.S. from Mexico. During the Cold War Mexico allowed spies hostile to the U.S. to operate freely. The attack on the Twin Towers in 2001 was cheered and applauded all across Mexico. Today Mexican school children are taught that the U.S. stole California, Arizona, new Mexico and Texas. (I KNOW THIS IS TRUE.) If you don't believe it, check out some Mexican textbooks written for their schoolchildren.

9. Although some illegal aliens enter this country for a better life, there are 6 billion people on this planet. At least 1 billion of those live on less than one dollar a day. If wanting a better life is a valid excuse to break the law and sneak into America, then let's allow those one billion to come to America and we'll turn the USA into a Third World nation overnight. Besides, there are 280 million native born Americans who want a better life. I'll bet Bill Gates and Donald Trump want a better life. When will the USA lifeboat be full? Since when is wanting a better life a good reason to trash another nation?

10. There is a labor shortage in this country. This is a lie. There are hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of American housewives, senior citizens, students, unemployed and underemployed who would gladly take jobs at a decent wage.

11. Is it racist to want secure borders. What is racist about wanting secure borders and a secure America? What is racist about not wanting people to sneak into America and steal benefits we have set aside for legal aliens, senior citizens, children and other legal residents? What is it about race that entitles people to violate our laws, steal identities, and take the American Dream without paying the price?

For about four decades American politicians have refused to secure our borders and look after the welfare of middle class Americans. These politicians have been of both parties. A huge debt to American society has resulted. This debt will be satisfied and the interest will be high. There has already been riots in the streets by illegal aliens and their supporters. There will be more. You, as a politician, have a choice to offend the illegal aliens who have stolen into this country and demanded the rights afforded to U.S. citizens or to offend those of us who are stakeholders in this country. The interest will be steep either way. There will be civil unrest. There will be a reckoning. Do you have the courage to do what is right for America? Or, will you bow to the wants and needs of those who don't even have the right to remain here?

There will be a reckoning. It will come in November of this year, again in 2008 and yet again in 2010.

We will not allow America to be stolen by third world agitators and thieves.

David J. Stoddard
U.S. Border Patrol (RET)

I'll let Snopes explain who he is.

[billybob]

Another good post, thanks Bruce. An interesting read. Y'know, that's all I was looking for, some information..... It'll take me a while to sift through it all and verify the claims made, but the expert testimony of a former border guard with 27 years experience certainly counts for more than the simplistic rantings of a rude and angry housewife from one of the whitest states.....

The essence of good debate is information. We take the information, verify it , and distill out the facts from the bias. From there, we move to informed opinion.Once we have an informed opinion, we can counter anything that we consider to be a misconception by presenting the facts.

I have no patience with people who consider that their opinion is the only one that matters and that everyone else,especially the foreigner, is an idiot. Bring me good facts and present them as information, rather than as proof that you have won, and you will retain my interest and respect.
The internet clowns who move the first pawn on the chessboard and then do an in-your-face-asshole victory dance are tedious.

[jinx]

Originally Posted by billybob

and you will retain my interest and respect.

And of course this is what we're all striving for.
Did I miss the post where you provided any relavant information on the topic?

[Dagney]

Originally Posted by billybob

one of the whitest states.....

I happen to live in the same state - which as I stated above has the 19th HIGHEST number of illegals in the population.

Just doing some quick math, that means there's approximately 31 states with fewer illegals in the population.

Hm...

I believe that's a blanket statement that was made in errror bob.

[billybob]

Originally Posted by Dagney

I happen to live in the same state - which as I stated above has the 19th HIGHEST number of illegals in the population.

That one sounds interesting......particularly in view of the official stats that put the state at around a quarter the average hispanic population. What measure do you use to obtain these figures? Aren't illegals, by definitition, notoriously difficult to put an accurate figure on?

We all make blanket statements. Some of us don't mind when asked to back them up with facts, others get crabby. I'll go back and do some research on the ethnic mix state by state, but of course, even that data gets skewed on some sites for political purposes.

[billybob]

Originally Posted by jinx

Did I miss the post where you provided any relavant information on the topic?

Which topic? there have been several in this thread.

My first post gave relevant information as to the legal status of children born in the US. I backed it up with the information that the hospital had confirmed that all of these children were legally eligible to be aided.

Now, in a good debating forum, 'legal entitlement' would be accepted as an argument by those who use 'it's the law' as a justification. Unfortunately, one individual chose it as the cue to attack the messenger [again ] on the basis of his country of residence, rather than debate the issue. The option to shut up and walk away was not taken until the thread had morphed into a broad-ranging discussion with multiple sideshows.

Having proved my argument to the initial post early on in the thread, I invite jinx to specify which of the sideshows he/she would like me to provide relevant information on.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by billybob

My first post gave relevant information as to the legal status of children born in the US. I backed it up with the information that the hospital had confirmed that all of these children were legally eligible to be aided.

Oh horseshit, you gave nothing. All you did was parrot what was clearly stated in the article, then attack Troy Anderson for being wrong which he clearly was not.

[billybob]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Oh horseshit, you gave nothing.

Correction, I pointed out that ALL children born in US hospitals are deemed US citizens, a legal point that Troy seems to conveniently overlook. the 'wrong' that you refer to is a matter of ethics, not of fact. Rabble rousing articles like the one under discussion serve no valid purpose. They exist only to sell Newspapers.


Now, about that horseshit,bruce.You may wish to retract it, or you may wish to eat it. Much as you would like it to, you can't make it stick.