Antisocial Personality Disorder

Originally Posted by wolf

I learned tonight, because we had 20-20 on the television at work that I am no longer responsible for my comfortably messy house or my need to obsessively purchase books and other cool things. I now have a soft addiction.

Isn't that cool? This is going to go really well with my Binge Eating Disorder (which replaced my just plain overeating) and Intermittent Explosive Disorder (which is my insurance-eligible road rage).

I saw that enabling crap too.

[wolf]

Originally Posted by rkzenrage

I saw that enabling crap too.

My only real regret about that story is that I am not a $500 per session consultant to help you deal with your feelings of guilt related to your soft addiction.

[9th Engineer]

A big problem with considering humans to be nothing more than automations is that if we are, then why is it wrong to harm or kill someone? It would essentially be the same as a fox killing a chicken to eat it, we don't object to that. Although people react in predictable ways to external stimuli you cannot discount the basic reality that any person has the power to control that reaction.

[Trilby]

Originally Posted by 9th Engineer

you cannot discount the basic reality that any person has the power to control that reaction.

I agree. Sometimes it FEELS like you can't control it, but you can.

There's another theory of human nature that I learned about last night while watching Sci-Fi's THE SEARCH FOR ATLANTIS (I watch too much TV, I realize that now) This theory says that people who are corrupt and greedy and anti-social are just displaying MORE of their ALIEN nature. Alien as in 'alien's came down and mated with humans a long time ago.' I'm a sucker for this kind of shit.

[Pangloss62]

Yes, I really don't believe in free will. So what? I'm still going to make choices and act accordingly. Who cares if those choices and actions are "free" or not? It's still me and my body. My present brain chemistry is based on genetics, experience, environment, and probably some chaos thrown in. And if I have a propensity toward self-examination, I can analyse myself and perhaps change my own behavior. I often think about why I think about what I think about. Yes, it can get confusing.

I have no shame in being a materialist. And there is no "right" or "wrong" either. That is why behaving ethically is hard; because we don't really have to.

[xoxoxoBruce]

They keep coming up with new explanations for why people do what they do and probably will as long as there's grant money and talk shows.

BUT, we are still liable for our actions. You have a brain tumor? chemical imbalance? bad childhood ? so what? If you cook and eat your children you pay.

[Pangloss62]

Personally, I've never believed in free will or a "soul," but for those that do, brain imaging evidence must seem like a threat.

You don't use science to explain your spiritual beliefs or lack there of.

Why not? You propose that "spiritual beliefs or lack there of [sic]" are somehow seperate from the brain? How could that be? From where does this "spiritual" component emerge? Flint's basic proposition is that anything outside our physicality enters the realm of the metaphysical (magic, etc). My only intent was to get people to talk about how almost all behaviors are now being reduced to brain chemistry, with a very explicit example. I said at the beginning how I feel about free will and a soul. Starting a thread with "I don't believe in God" would not produce much useful discussion.

Either "God" or this "greater power" (or both) are indeed dicks or there are no such things. To conclude the latter does not mean we should just sit on our hands and not do anything. Nihilism does not have to be negative. It's a starting point. It's up to "us," whatever our bodies can do to improve the world and help others. The "Golden Rule" should not be the exclusive province of the religious or spiritual. Are we not men, marichiko?

Originally Posted by Pangloss62

Why not? You propose that "spiritual beliefs or lack there of [sic]" are somehow seperate from the brain? How could that be? From where does this "spiritual" component emerge?

Why not what?

Np, I do not propose that a spiritual outlook is somehow seperate from the brain. It is our highly evolved brains which allow us to have a sense of awareness as unique selves, allows us to question and argue such things as metaphysics, makes us stand in awe of the stars on a clear summer's night. Does this understanding mean that I think physics is behind all of these things? Not necessarily. I am saying that it is an act of hubris on the part of scientists who proport to know all the answers to these things. I do not know these answrs and I studied science and the scientific method for 6 years in one of the finest science departments in one of this country's better universities. I became especially intrigued by the philosophy of science and made a study of that as well. In the end, Shakespeare summed it up as well as anyone, "There is more on heaven and earth than ever dreamed of in your philosophy."

Originally Posted by Pangloss62

Starting a thread with "I don't believe in God" would not produce much useful discussion.

I'll accept that, but why feed into the hands of the syncophants?

Originally Posted by Pangloss62

The "Golden Rule" should not be the exclusive province of the religious or spiritual. Are we not men, marichiko?

We are men and we are women, both. Nowhere did I imply that the Golden Rule is not a valid precept for people of any persuasion to attempt to follow. Try reading Edmund O. Wilson for starters. If you want to be a decent human being on purely scientific precepts, Wilson is as good a philosopher of science to start with as any. However, do not tell me that science has proved ther is no God or that science has proved we are all automotons running our predestined little lives to an extant that would make a Calvinist proud. Science has not done these things.