Where Is Sex? - Page 3

Rock Steady · 12-18-2006, 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibram

... I resign to being treated like and calling myself a guy. But I resent it. I hate everything that being masculine, that being a guy, stands for.
....

I completely identify with that and I am 51 yo. I hate the male-vs-male competitions.

Hang in there. You can recreate what it means to be a guy. Last year, for Halloween I went into work dressed up as one of my girlfriends there. She loved it and to this day talks about it and shows pix of me. I go on girls-nights-out to shows and concerts. I wear black capri pants, silver anklets, and ...

Still, when I am with a group of my girlfriends they still treat me like the guy of the group. So, you can't completely escape it. But, it's still lots of fun for all of us.

On one date a couple of months ago, this gal took me out to a show with a limo to the city and the works. She was completely in control and it was a gender swapping evening. At the end I told her I didn't know whether she wanted me to be her boyfriend or girlfriend. And she said, "yeah, and I kept switching that on you all evening."

It's great when you finally hook up with people that get you. Hang in there, Ibram.

Phil · 12-18-2006, 02:07 PM

i tailposted (a word I, thats me, invented!). to say that the Innuit Indians recognise 11 genders. i cant list them.

Ibby · 12-18-2006, 03:23 PM

Well then my all means, please do!

Ibby · 12-19-2006, 10:52 AM

I've just had an epiphany while meditating on Hedwig and the Angry Inch and listening to Shankar a little while ago...

I don't care.
I'll leave other people to worry about my gender. I don't need to. I know what I like, I know what I don't, and I don't need to know what I am. I will act as I feel, I will do what is right, I won't conform to any gender stereotypes for the sake of doing so. Just as I have been all along. I don't need to know or care what I identify as.

12-19-2006, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil

i tailposted (a word I, thats me, invented!). to say that the Innuit Indians recognise 11 genders. i cant list them.

I believe it was, we, Mr.

Hmmmm... I wonder how many I got to do before I got married?

Ibby · 12-19-2006, 11:08 AM

ohhhh shit, i just realized he said CAN'T list, not can.

Oops. Whatever.

Sundae · 12-19-2006, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibram

I don't care.
I'll leave other people to worry about my gender. I don't need to. I know what I like, I know what I don't, and I don't need to know what I am. I will act as I feel, I will do what is right, I won't conform to any gender stereotypes for the sake of doing so. Just as I have been all along. I don't need to know or care what I identify as.

This is the right attitude of course. It is far better than saying you hate everything male or being a man. Like other posters have said, that can only apply to a fixed definition of male, maleness etc. The closest men in my life are very different from one another - my father for example displays some typically feminine characteristics, but in other ways is "all man".

Just make sure you don't cut yourself off from anything you might enjoy by paying attention to other people's sterotypes. I know a guy who loves cooking, shopping, arthouse cinema, poetry, respects women and is a great shoulder to cry on. He also plays rugby, is sick in pub gardens when he gets drunk and rubs his bare arse against restaurant windows. He can't talk to all his friends about everything he enjoys, but at least he gets what he wants out of life.

And finally - bit of a long sig? Maybe it's just me, but it hurts my brain a bit when the sig is routinely longer than the post.

Ibby · 12-19-2006, 12:17 PM

the sig's only temporary, I just had to through that out there.

And its still true that I hate masculinity, I hate machismo, I hate almost everything stereotypically male. So?

Sundae · 12-19-2006, 12:23 PM

Quote:

mas·cu·line / Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[mas-kyuh-lin] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective 1. pertaining to or characteristic of a man or men: masculine attire.
2. having qualities traditionally ascribed to men, as strength and boldness.

So? I think you're doing a disservice to half the population of the world. There are many positive traits displayed by men (quick example above)- and if you didn't think so surely you'd be posting on a mainly female forum?

Obviously the way you feel about your/ their gender is totally your business, but I'd say the same to a woman posting that she hated everything about women and being female... seems a pity to have such disdain for so many people.

12-19-2006, 01:04 PM

This is really bothering me... I was not told before I got older and now I'll never get to do all eleven. I feel very cheated.

Ibby · 12-19-2006, 01:09 PM

I dont hate all men. I hate the posing, the preening, the strength, the oafishness, the rudeness, the unintelligence, the brute force and brawn that makes up machismo.

Like, take the weight room, for instance. We had to do weight room as a unit in Gym. The guys, instead of chatting or whatever, would spend ALL their time lifting absurd amounts, grunting and yelling and slapping eachothers chests and bellowing and just generally doing their best 'primate house' impressions.

THAT is what I hate about machismo.

Undertoad · 12-19-2006, 01:20 PM

I was against all that stuff when I was a lad, partly because I was raised by my mom and partly because I was a pencil-neck geek who would not fight anyone under any circumstances and came to hate physical violence or threat of it as force.

Now I understand it a little bit more and see the value of it. By thinking about it in terms of fighting, I couldn't stand it. But there is value in simple toughness, for one's self and for one's society.

Because life is tough and there is a lot of tough stuff to deal with. Somebody has to do the tough stuff.

Somebody has to buck up and run into the burning building. Somebody is going to have get out and push this car. Somebody is going to have to wrangle those hay bales into place in the barn. Somebody is going to have to walk miles back in the snow and try to find help. Somebody is going to have to handle those assholes trying to take back Afghanistan. Somebody is going to have to fix those truck scales. And whether or not we admit it, it's not only gender roles that have the men doing those things, 9 times out of 10.

Ibby · 12-19-2006, 01:42 PM

I understand that it does serve a societal purpose... So does death. That doesn't mean I like it.

Griff · 12-19-2006, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibram

I understand that it does serve a societal purpose... So does death. That doesn't mean I like it.

The important thing is that you like yourself and your own definition. I must admit that I'm really uncomfortable with this idea of hating masculinity. You do understand that this is really irrational from an evolutionary perspective? It is equivalent to hating feminity for being too nurturing. Let the meatheads define themselves as well, they may grow up someday.

footfootfoot · 12-19-2006, 07:24 PM

Where is the love
(Where is the love)
Where is the love
(Where is the love)
Where is the love
(Where is the love)
Where is the love

Where is the love
You said you'd give to me
Soon as you were free
Will it ever be
Where is the love

You told me that you didn't love him
And you were gonna say goodbye
But if you really didn't mean it
Why did you have to lie

Where is the love
You said was mine all mine
Till the end of time
Was it just a lie
Where is the love

If you had had a sudden change of heart
I wish that you would tell me so
Don't leave me hangin on the promises
You've got to let me know

[Instrumental Interlude]

Oh, how I wish I never met you
I guess it must have been my fate
To fall in love with someone else's love
All I can do is wait
(That's all I can do)
Yeah, hey, yeah

Where is the love

12-18-2006, 03:23 PM	#33
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	Well then my all means, please do! __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

12-19-2006, 10:52 AM	#34
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	I've just had an epiphany while meditating on Hedwig and the Angry Inch and listening to Shankar a little while ago... I don't care. I'll leave other people to worry about my gender. I don't need to. I know what I like, I know what I don't, and I don't need to know what I am. I will act as I feel, I will do what is right, I won't conform to any gender stereotypes for the sake of doing so. Just as I have been all along. I don't need to know or care what I identify as. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

12-19-2006, 11:08 AM	#36
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	ohhhh shit, i just realized he said CAN'T list, not can. Oops. Whatever. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

12-19-2006, 12:17 PM	#38
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	the sig's only temporary, I just had to through that out there. And its still true that I hate masculinity, I hate machismo, I hate almost everything stereotypically male. So? __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

12-19-2006, 01:09 PM	#41
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	I dont hate all men. I hate the posing, the preening, the strength, the oafishness, the rudeness, the unintelligence, the brute force and brawn that makes up machismo. Like, take the weight room, for instance. We had to do weight room as a unit in Gym. The guys, instead of chatting or whatever, would spend ALL their time lifting absurd amounts, grunting and yelling and slapping eachothers chests and bellowing and just generally doing their best 'primate house' impressions. THAT is what I hate about machismo. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

12-18-2006, 02:07 PM	#32
Phil Hoodoo Guru Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 304	i tailposted (a word I, thats me, invented!). to say that the Innuit Indians recognise 11 genders. i cant list them.

12-19-2006, 01:04 PM	#40
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	This is really bothering me... I was not told before I got older and now I'll never get to do all eleven. I feel very cheated.

12-19-2006, 01:20 PM	#42
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	I was against all that stuff when I was a lad, partly because I was raised by my mom and partly because I was a pencil-neck geek who would not fight anyone under any circumstances and came to hate physical violence or threat of it as force. Now I understand it a little bit more and see the value of it. By thinking about it in terms of fighting, I couldn't stand it. But there is value in simple toughness, for one's self and for one's society. Because life is tough and there is a lot of tough stuff to deal with. Somebody has to do the tough stuff. Somebody has to buck up and run into the burning building. Somebody is going to have get out and push this car. Somebody is going to have to wrangle those hay bales into place in the barn. Somebody is going to have to walk miles back in the snow and try to find help. Somebody is going to have to handle those assholes trying to take back Afghanistan. Somebody is going to have to fix those truck scales. And whether or not we admit it, it's not only gender roles that have the men doing those things, 9 times out of 10.

12-19-2006, 01:42 PM	#43
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	I understand that it does serve a societal purpose... So does death. That doesn't mean I like it. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

12-19-2006, 07:24 PM	#45
footfootfoot To shreds, you say? Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet! Posts: 18,449	Where is the love (Where is the love) Where is the love (Where is the love) Where is the love (Where is the love) Where is the love Where is the love You said you'd give to me Soon as you were free Will it ever be Where is the love You told me that you didn't love him And you were gonna say goodbye But if you really didn't mean it Why did you have to lie Where is the love You said was mine all mine Till the end of time Was it just a lie Where is the love If you had had a sudden change of heart I wish that you would tell me so Don't leave me hangin on the promises You've got to let me know [Instrumental Interlude] Oh, how I wish I never met you I guess it must have been my fate To fall in love with someone else's love All I can do is wait (That's all I can do) Yeah, hey, yeah Where is the love __________________ The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs

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