Second Chances

[yesman065]

Originally Posted by glatt

When I say the Democrats want to stop losing, what I mean is that the war is already lost, and pulling out now (or at least setting a timetable to pull out) is simply having the guts to admit what is plain for all to see. It's over, and we lost. It's time to stop investing in a losing proposition. Cut our losses. Let bygones be bygones.

It al depends on who you get your information from - It is not plain to me at all that this is lost - Gen. Patreus is neither dillusional nor a fool and I'll take his opinion over anyone elses at this point. Maybe we should have a vote in Iraq - a real one - and if they really want us to leave, then so be it. The infighting and dissention here is certainly not helping things abroad.

[BigV]

Originally Posted by yesman065

It al depends on who you get your information from - It is not plain to me at all that this is lost - Gen. Patreus is neither dillusional nor a fool and I'll take his oipinion over anyone elses at this point. Maybe we should have a vote in Iran - a real one - and if they really want us to leave, then so be it. The infighting and dissention here is certainly not helping things abroad.

Attention to detail is important, yesman065. Do you really think we'll be leaving Iran? Ever?

Tell ya something else. Dissent is patriotic.

[yesman065]

Originally Posted by BigV

Attention to detail is important, yesman065. Do you really think we'll be leaving Iran? Ever?

Tell ya something else. Dissent is patriotic.

Yes, I think we will leave when things settle down, obviously not 100% though. I still think we should try and find out what the majority of Iraqis want - believe me - if they don't want us there then I'm all for every single American to begin leaving right now - period. Also, I'm aware that dissent CAN BE patriotic, but is not always.

[glatt]

Originally Posted by yesman065

The infighting and dissention here is certainly not helping things abroad.

On the contrary, it is helping a lot.

The more infighting and dissent, the faster the troops will come home. Bush had been on autopilot with this war for 3-4 years before the dissent and infighting made him pay attention. If we had this infighting and dissent earlier, maybe Bush would have tried his surge after two years of a stalemate rather than waiting for four years of stalemate. If we had this infighting and dissent before the war began, maybe we could have avoided the whole mess in the first place.