free country

Gomez da Killah · 03-13-2003, 10:30 AM

how is it that ( in america), it is illegal to ride a bicycle w/o a helmet or drive a car w/o a seat belt, and yet, it is a free country.

Jakeline · 03-13-2003, 10:57 AM

Define "free country." When you're a kid, everyone tosses it around like it means you can do whatever the hell you want and you can never be compelled to do something you don't want to do. "I don't have to eat my vegetables.. it's a free country."

But we all knows that's bullshit. It being a "free country" has nothing to do with eating vegetables. So, what do you mean by "free country?"

russotto · 03-13-2003, 11:02 AM

It's simpler than that. America is no longer a free country. It's only less authoritarian than many others (and engaged in a race to the bottom, too)

Undertoad · 03-13-2003, 12:09 PM

In a country this large, built on the backs of factions that compete for the hearts and minds of everyone in the country, it is nearly impossible to develop a logically sound legal system free of contradictions.

It's easy to imagine a system that tried hard to prevent such contradictions tripping over itself, and becoming more authoritative in the process.

Humans are imperfect, and any government that is truly "by the people for the people" is probably going to be imperfect too.

Maybe the best we can do is to set into motion a system based on natural individual rights (check), and to work as hard as we can, as individuals, to see that it remains as free and just as possible.

Gomez da Killah · 03-13-2003, 04:59 PM

i was just trying to bring to light the fact that our government is consistantly making more and more of our judgement calls for us. where does it all end? before you know it, there are going to be laws telling us what to wear, who to marry, and where and when to go to work.
consider this, in this "free country", we have more laws than any other country in the world; and they are making more and more every day. laws that are being created by rich people for rich people, without any concern for the common citizens.
maybe its just me; but, in my short walk, i have been noticeing that "democracy"seems to be giving way to neo-fascism in a capitalist suit, the more rights we give up, the more they will take. what ever happened to the "Bill of Rights"?

jaguar · 03-13-2003, 11:41 PM

Was it tacticus who said something along the lines of 'the more numerous the laws the more corrupt the state' ?

Uryoces · 03-14-2003, 02:23 AM

We have so many laws because coffee is f*cking hot, and you shouldn't put it near your crotch. This chemical desiccant pack, do not eat! Keep knife out of children! We have so many laws because no one will take responsibility for their own actions. I don't remember who said it, but the idea was that we remove all speedometers from cars and replace it with a day-glo orange sticker that reads You alone are responsible for operating this car in a safe manner

I believe it was the wise prophet Austin Powers who once said:

Quote:

We have freedom ... with ... responsibility. It's a very groovy time! Yeah!

Oh yeah, found it:

Quote:

Whatever form of government we want, we have to ensure that it can effectively replace what exists. We must not fall into the trap of enlightenment. We must not see what we want, but what is. We have to take human nature into account in this. We have a republic today, a representative democracy. People are chosen ostensibly for their expertise, for their ability to take care of the day-to -day running of the country. If we decide to take this control for ourselves [e.g. Tim Eyman and his ill-advised Proposition 695, which devastated the transportation budget of Washington state, which the voters approved], we, every one of us must be ready to become economists, scientists, engineers, and project managers. This is not likely to happen. The reality of this situation is what the Greeks called 'mob rule'.

If we want the revolution, we must be prepared to pay for it ourselves, not to make others pay with ill-cast votes and Ryder trucks.

--Me

Almost missed this!

Elspode · 03-17-2003, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Uryoces
We have so many laws because no one will take responsibility for their own actions.

Bingo! This is why I'm a Wiccan...because I believe in taking responsibility for my own actions. I can't abide anyone else claiming my screwups, nor my successes. And no one can take away my sins. They're mine, I earned 'em. Let Jesus go get his own.

I blame a legal system that rewards stupidity while allowing real injustice to prosper. I'm no commie, but somewhere money has something to do with all of this.

smoothmoniker · 03-17-2003, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaguar
Was it tacticus who said something along the lines of 'the more numerous the laws the more corrupt the state' ?

"The Government is best which governs least"

Henry David Thoreau, On Civil Disobedience

russotto · 03-18-2003, 12:42 PM

Quoting or paraphrasing Jefferson, I believe.

xoxoxoBruce · 04-16-2003, 07:10 PM

LIFE, LIBERTY AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS*

* Providing it doesn't interfere with blah blah blah etc etc 3000 paragraphs of small print

03-13-2003, 10:30 AM	#1
Gomez da Killah i'd rather be sleeping Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 12	free country how is it that ( in america), it is illegal to ride a bicycle w/o a helmet or drive a car w/o a seat belt, and yet, it is a free country.

03-13-2003, 04:59 PM	#5
Gomez da Killah i'd rather be sleeping Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 12	free country i was just trying to bring to light the fact that our government is consistantly making more and more of our judgement calls for us. where does it all end? before you know it, there are going to be laws telling us what to wear, who to marry, and where and when to go to work. consider this, in this "free country", we have more laws than any other country in the world; and they are making more and more every day. laws that are being created by rich people for rich people, without any concern for the common citizens. maybe its just me; but, in my short walk, i have been noticeing that "democracy"seems to be giving way to neo-fascism in a capitalist suit, the more rights we give up, the more they will take. what ever happened to the "Bill of Rights"? __________________ love your country, fear your government

03-13-2003, 11:41 PM	#6
jaguar whig Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 5,075	Was it tacticus who said something along the lines of 'the more numerous the laws the more corrupt the state' ? __________________ Good friends, good books and a sleepy conscience: this is the ideal life. - Twain

04-16-2003, 07:10 PM	#11
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	LIFE, LIBERTY AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS* * Providing it doesn't interfere with blah blah blah etc etc 3000 paragraphs of small print __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

03-13-2003, 10:57 AM	#2
Jakeline Disorderly Orderly Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Southern California Posts: 54	Define "free country." When you're a kid, everyone tosses it around like it means you can do whatever the hell you want and you can never be compelled to do something you don't want to do. "I don't have to eat my vegetables.. it's a free country." But we all knows that's bullshit. It being a "free country" has nothing to do with eating vegetables. So, what do you mean by "free country?"

03-13-2003, 11:02 AM	#3
russotto Professor Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 1,788	It's simpler than that. America is no longer a free country. It's only less authoritarian than many others (and engaged in a race to the bottom, too)

03-13-2003, 12:09 PM	#4
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	In a country this large, built on the backs of factions that compete for the hearts and minds of everyone in the country, it is nearly impossible to develop a logically sound legal system free of contradictions. It's easy to imagine a system that tried hard to prevent such contradictions tripping over itself, and becoming more authoritative in the process. Humans are imperfect, and any government that is truly "by the people for the people" is probably going to be imperfect too. Maybe the best we can do is to set into motion a system based on natural individual rights (check), and to work as hard as we can, as individuals, to see that it remains as free and just as possible.

03-18-2003, 12:42 PM	#10
russotto Professor Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 1,788	Quoting or paraphrasing Jefferson, I believe.

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