I'm a Birdbrain

[Whit]

      I just wanted to say that I put this sig line up before this discussion floated anywhere near souls...

[xoxoxoBruce]

Quzah said

That's absurd. You're telling me you can't imagine an animal in so much pain that it would rather not be alive? Yes, this is slightly different than "not being born", but the end result is the same.

What I'm telling you is I can imagine an animal in so much pain they would rather not be. The concept of alive and dead means nothing to them. All they know is being eaten or not being eaten.
When a lion chases the herd, they all try to avoid him. But once the lion brings one down, what does the rest of the herd do? They stop, watch for a minute to make sure the lion is done chasing, then business as usual. They're not being eaten so they eat. They don't have a memorial service for their fallen comrade.
They really don't care about anything but the moment. There is no past or future in their conscious thought. They have memory of routes and food sources but you'll never convince me they can't wait to get back to XYZ because it was pretty there.
Domestic animals don't even have the lion to keep them on their toes.
The basic domestic cow is never threatened or in real danger short of lightning or a motor vehicle and they aren't aware of that till it's too late. The lead pretty bucolic lives until we eat them.

[quzah]

Originally posted by xoxoxoBruce
The concept of alive and dead means nothing to them. All they know is being eaten or not being eaten.

What are you fucking stupid all of this sudden? They have no concept of death and dying? Get real. That's got to be the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Animals have no concept of dying... You truely boggle the mind.

So much for that whole survival instinct theory huh?

Give me a hit of whatever it is you're smoking.


Quzah.

[LUVBUGZ]

Originally posted by xoxoxoBruce

What I'm telling you is I can imagine an animal in so much pain they would rather not be. The concept of alive and dead means nothing to them. All they know is being eaten or not being eaten.
When a lion chases the herd, they all try to avoid him. But once the lion brings one down, what does the rest of the herd do? They stop, watch for a minute to make sure the lion is done chasing, then business as usual. They're not being eaten so they eat. They don't have a memorial service for their fallen comrade.
They really don't care about anything but the moment. There is no past or future in their conscious thought. They have memory of routes and food sources but you'll never convince me they can't wait to get back to XYZ because it was pretty there.
Domestic animals don't even have the lion to keep them on their toes.
The basic domestic cow is never threatened or in real danger short of lightning or a motor vehicle and they aren't aware of that till it's too late. The lead pretty bucolic lives until we eat them.

I don't agree with you here, Bruce. I have seen video of lions trying to kill a baby elephant and the entire elephant herd forms a circle around the baby in an attempt to prevent the lions from killing it. I've also seen where a mother elk/caribou/moose will defend her young from predators by trying to gore them and kick them. Also, if a member of a wolf pack is killed or dies the rest of the pack is very agitated, revisits the dead body, and mourns their loss by howling. As far as domestic animals, one of my cats sat meowing on the sidewalk where one of her adult daughters was hit by a car and lay dying. I was gone at the time and found her doing this when I got home several hours later. My neighbors saw her much earlier in the morning doing the same thing. After I removed her lifeless body, the mama kitty still stayed at the sidewalk looking for her daughter. I don't know if you'd call this a memorial service, but she sure seemed sad and upset that her daughter was killed. I think you're wrong in saying that animals don't care what happens to one of their own. I think they do care, but in some instances they are helpless in trying to defend against predator attacks.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally posted by quzah

What are you fucking stupid all of this sudden? They have no concept of death and dying? Get real. That's got to be the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Animals have no concept of dying... You truely boggle the mind.

So much for that whole survival instinct theory huh?

Give me a hit of whatever it is you're smoking.


Quzah.

Gosh 'o golly, how am I to respond to such an eloquent post.

Bugz, yes some animals stand and fight especially mothers defending there young. I know elephants mourn and probably primates. I simplified it to the type of animals we domesticate and raise for food.

[Elspode]

I think we should just sum it up succinctly and all of us admit that we're fucking stupid.

That oughta settle the discussion once and for all...

[quzah]

Originally posted by xoxoxoBruce
I know elephants mourn and probably primates. I simplified it to the type of animals we domesticate and raise for food.

You simplified it because you don't want to give admirable traits to your food. It's ok, I know you won't admit there's more to your food than you think there is. You're stubborn and in denial, that's fine. Now that we've crossed that bridge, let's move along shall we? But please, since you're the one who mentioned "reality", try to join the rest of us, ok?


Quzah.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Next time I eat a cow I'll wonder if it pondered its navel, its mortality and other "admirable" traits.


Oh, and Els. I'm not fuckin' stupid. I'm not fuckin' anybody.:p

[Whit]

I'm not fuckin' stupid. I'm not fuckin' anybody.

      We're all glad to know you take a break from it to post Bruce.

      You know, I was just sitting here, thinking how serene and noble deer are. The mothers protecting the young the adult males protecting the group, even with their own lives at times. And so graceful, yet powerful. They taste great too. Deer chili freakin' rocks.

[xoxoxoBruce]

You misunderstand, Whit. I don't do it, I just talk about it.
Enjoy your chili.

[LUVBUGZ]

Originally posted by xoxoxoBruce
You misunderstand, Whit. I don't do it, I just talk about it.

And the truth reveals it's ugly head. Bruce isn't *really* a dirty old man, he just plays one in the Cellar:p

[xoxoxoBruce]

It's not truths, it's my ugly head that slows me down.

[LUVBUGZ]

Originally posted by xoxoxoBruce
It's not truths, it's my ugly head that slows me down.

Which "head"?:p

[blue]

I AM THE RESORECTOUR (sp?)!!!

I'm pretty sure I fucked that up.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Why?