China wrecked the Copenhagen deal

[xoxoxoBruce]

Traitor.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by spudcon

You guys should stop arguing and be glad China scuttled Copenhagen. I'm going to Walmart to buy some worthless Chinese junk with my worthless American dollars.

[aliasyzy]

I feel interesting that an American has the audacity to blame China for Copenhagen.

It's a common sense in the world that US is the first to blame for the global warming, and it's still US who jeopardized the Kyoto Protocol. If not for the interference of US, the earth will never be the way it is now in terms of global warming.



the data of these two charts are from World Resources Institute
now is 2010, but it won't change a lot on the shape of these two charts.



Do US people have the right to emit more CO2 than other people in the world? (five times CO2 emission per person compared to China! )

It's true that China emits more and more CO2 and it's becoming the biggest emission source, but it's simply because China produce a lot of goods for the world. And if it's not China, there will be other contries to do the same as long as there are demands.
China emits CO2 since it's the factory for the developed countries. It earns a little money and takes the price of worsening environment. (lower part of the value chain) . Intriguingly, US, who earns the big money and don't have to be the big factory, emits as much CO2 as China. Why? What for? Maybe you guys could tell me.

Let's see what's said in copenhagen by US chief negotiator Stern.

“We absolutely recognize our historic role in putting emissions in the atmosphere up there that are there now,” Mr. Stern said sternly, “but the sense of guilt or culpability or reparations, I just categorically reject that.”

“We are certainly not going to become part of the Kyoto Protocol, so that’s not on the table,” Mr. Stern said at his news conference on Wednesday. “If you mean basically taking the Kyoto Protocol and putting a new title on it, we’re not going to do that either.”

Who wrecked the Copenhagen deal? Use your brain instead of swallow those propaganda and prejudices!

[glatt]

Originally Posted by aliasyzy

the data of these two charts are from World Resources Institute
now is 2010, but it won't change a lot on the shape of these two charts.

It will change them both significantly. China has passed the US in total emissions. Not that the US has anything to brag about.

[aliasyzy]

Originally Posted by glatt

It will change them both significantly. China has passed the US in total emissions. Not that the US has anything to brag about.

for the first chart, it won't change significantly, because the stock is too large for the new increase to change it.

for the second chart, in the link you give, US 18.67 ton per capita, China 4.57 ton per capita (less than 1/4 of US), still doesn't change significantly

[jinx]

Interesting that aussies burn more per capita at 18.74 tons...

[glatt]

Originally Posted by aliasyzy

for the first chart, it won't change significantly, because the stock is too large for the new increase to change it.

for the second chart, in the link you give, US 18.67 ton per capita, China 4.57 ton per capita (less than 1/4 of US), still doesn't change significantly

Oh, I apologize. I didn't see that the 1st chart covered the last century. I thought is was a picture in time of 2005. Yeah you're right. Nothing we do will change history. Pretty pointless chart, that first one. If you are trying to make the US look bad and guilty of something, maybe you should post a chart of emissions since the global warming theory has become accepted by mainstream science in the last decade or so. Looking at the last 105 years is just asinine.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Bullshit, the past has nothing to do with it. The US along with the other big countries tried to actually do something about it, China refused, flat out refused, to try and fix the problem.

[classicman]

[quote=aliasyzy;625587]

It's a common sense in the world that US is the first to blame for the global warming,

Oh Please, The US is the first to be blamed for all the ills of the world. We do more for every other nation on this planet - bar none. And we get a lot of shit for it. I'd be interested to know what would happen if we just said "Fuck you" to all these countries that need us to finance just about everything. I wonder...

Do the Chinese have the right to ship their polluted and poisonous products all over the world?

A little money? Are you kidding me? You talk about biased sources - Whew. Look at your own. Seems to me you're an apologist for China.

Who wrecked the Copenhagen deal? Use your brain instead of swallow those propaganda and prejudices!

There are a lot more sources who blame China than the US.

I think it may be you who is swallowing a great deal of propaganda.

[aliasyzy]

Originally Posted by glatt

Oh, I apologize. I didn't see that the 1st chart covered the last century. I thought is was a picture in time of 2005. Yeah you're right. Nothing we do will change history. Pretty pointless chart, that first one. If you are trying to make the US look bad and guilty of something, maybe you should post a chart of emissions since the global warming theory has become accepted by mainstream science in the last decade or so. Looking at the last 105 years is just asinine.

Is it meaningless to look at the past? After US emitting such a huge amount of CO2 on its way to become a superpower, you think it's fair to tell other countries we will start over and you are not allowed to emit CO2 while at the same time itself remains the first place in terms of emission per capita?

[jinx]

Well, is emitting huge amounts a bad idea or isn't it?

[Shawnee123]

You can't put too much water in a nuclear reactor.

[aliasyzy]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Bullshit, the past has nothing to do with it. The US along with the other big countries tried to actually do something about it, China refused, flat out refused, to try and fix the problem.

Really? That's just your side of the story to keep you feel good about yourself.

Please tell me why US won't accept kyoto protocal?

What have US done? don't tell me that empty promise of 100 billion thing. Hillary just said that "the United States will help raise $100 billion" Where will this $100 billion come from, how much will US pay? not a word has been said! Do you think US could afford $100 billion on the ground that obama has already been busy with all the empty promises he made before?

[glatt]

Originally Posted by aliasyzy

[the USA] remains the first place in terms of emission per capita

Wrong. According to the info at Wikipedia, Australia is in 1st place per capita. Jinx pointed that out a couple posts above this one. And China is in first place overall.

Originally Posted by Shawnee123

You can't put too much water in a nuclear reactor.

Haggis

[aliasyzy]

[quote=classicman;625612]

Originally Posted by aliasyzy

There are a lot more sources who blame China than the US.

I think it may be you who is swallowing a great deal of propaganda.

It's simply because US is No.1 in propaganda/PR as well as in its military power. And people always tend to say and believe what benefits them most.

I have to go to sleep, it's midnight in China. Good day.

BTW: Chinese Government propagandas but it's very poor at this sophisticated skill, so i don't think i will swallow any of it.