Should the US have a third party? - Page 2

SamIam · 11-03-2011, 10:04 AM

Me three.

The last time a third party won the White House it was back at the turn of the last century when Teddy Roosevelt and his Bull Moose party took the White House by storm. Bully!

I'd like to see a party that actually represented the American people for a change, but the chances of that are slim.

Spexxvet · 11-03-2011, 10:11 AM

I think Teddy won as a repubican, then lost as a bull moose.[/picky]

SamIam · 11-03-2011, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

I think Teddy won as a repubican, then lost as a bull moose.[/picky]

Thanks for clarifying that. My Teddy Roosevelt knowledge is a tad rusty. I loked him up on Wikepedia, and while he indeed was elected on a Republican ticket, he promoted a populist agenda, especially when he stepped up to the presidency after McKinley's assassination. He continued to extol populism when he ran for president a second time.

The final time Teddy ran, that was with the Bull Moose Party. While he didn't win, the Bull Moose Party came in second, something no third party has done before or since.

(End of history lesson)

Gravdigr · 11-03-2011, 04:16 PM

Toga, Toga, Toga

TheMercenary · 11-03-2011, 05:27 PM

They really need to execute George Soro's political parties.....

GunMaster357 · 11-03-2011, 06:27 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong but the USA do have other political parties. It is the indirect election system that prevents most of them to come to the front.

http://www.politics1.com/parties.htm

Lamplighter · 11-03-2011, 06:52 PM

Yes, of course. Probably ~ 50
The US was formed as a republic (representative government),
while France came in as closer to a democracy.

But, third parties just don't succeed, here or elsewhere... they end up as coalitions,
with a minority holding excessive power via threats to move to the other side.

Remember Italy just a few years ago...
elections every other week because coalitions would form and dissolve over small issues.

To my eye, it's up the the Republican's+TeaParty's to decide what the Republican party is going to be.
Then, it's up to voters to decide which party has their best interests at heart.

ZenGum · 11-03-2011, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Then, it's up to voters to decide which party has their best interests at heart.

Ahh, that's one of those Zen riddles which has no answer better than "a fish!".

A third party in the current system would be exposed to the same corrupting environment that the other two exist in. That is what needs to be changed.

Each candidate has to sell out for "campaign contributions" because if they don't, the other will, and will blow them out of the water. So they both do. The solution, of course, is to mumblemumblemumble .

Although you might seriously consider preferential voting, at least for the Presidential election. And abolishing that electoral colleges business to eliminate the "battleground state" effect.

SamIam · 11-03-2011, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GunMaster357

Correct me if I'm wrong but the USA do have other political parties. It is the indirect election system that prevents most of them to come to the front.

http://www.politics1.com/parties.htm

Well, sure - there are any number of parties out there. But none of them have the clout to stand up to the two parties which now comprise corporate congress.

I for one would love to have a third choice that had an actual potential to win the elections. I understand that's just some fantasy. I just threw it out there to stir up a discussion.

SamIam · 11-03-2011, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZenGum

Ahh, that's one of those Zen riddles which has no answer better than "a fish!".

A third party in the current system would be exposed to the same corrupting environment that the other two exist in. That is what needs to be changed.

Bingo! A fish it is!

What is desperately needed is election reform. Create a public pool from which each candidate draws the same amount. Anyone caught using money from any other source to finance their campaign gets to go to jail.

Naturally, this isn't going to happen either. Corporate congress would never pass a law which removes power from special interests and financial gains for themselves.

I love this country but our political system sucks. The US is headed down a very dark road.

Lamplighter · 11-03-2011, 07:53 PM

A Constitutional Amendment requirement on every ballot issue:

None of the Above (_X_)

ZenGum · 11-03-2011, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SamIam

Well, sure - there are any number of parties out there. But none of them have the clout to stand up to the two parties which now comprise corporate congress.

I for one would love to have a third choice that had an actual potential to win the elections. I understand that's just some fantasy. I just threw it out there to stir up a discussion.

Preferential voting!

HungLikeJesus · 11-03-2011, 08:33 PM

What if we just got rid of political parties all together?

SamIam · 11-03-2011, 08:36 PM

Hah! What if we just got rid of politicians all together?

Lamplighter · 11-03-2011, 09:03 PM

A basic question... If ALL politicians are bad, were they bad before they were elected ?

That is, does it take a certain internal "bad-ness" for a person to work
their way up through the civic organization offices (e.g., PTA), County,
State, and then Federal.
Or is it primarily the degradation of holding public office that erodes the person.

I've worked in State governments and found most State
employees were trying and actually did do a good job,
but the public view of government workers is really poor.

View Poll Results: Does the US need a third party?
Yes, anything is better than the two we have now	6	33.33%
No, the Democrats and Republicans were good enough for grandpa, and they're good enough for me	0	0%
Nice thought, but impossible to implement for a variety of reasons	7	38.89%
No, what we need is a revolution	3	16.67%
Huh? Who me? I dunno	2	11.11%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 18. You may not vote on this poll

11-03-2011, 10:11 AM	#17
Spexxvet Makes some feel uncomfortable Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 10,346	I think Teddy won as a repubican, then lost as a bull moose.[/picky] __________________ "I'm certainly free, nay compelled, to spread the gospel of Spex. " - xoxoxoBruce

11-03-2011, 04:16 PM	#19
Gravdigr The Un-Tuckian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: South Central...KY that is Posts: 39,517	Toga, Toga, Toga __________________ These statements have not been evaluated by the FDA, EPA, FBI, DEA, CDC, or FDIC. These statements are not intended to diagnose, cause, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. If you feel you have been harmed/offended by, or, disagree with any of the above statements or images, please feel free to fuck right off.

11-03-2011, 05:27 PM	#20
TheMercenary “Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo” Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Savannah, Georgia Posts: 21,393	They really need to execute George Soro's political parties..... __________________ Anyone but the this most fuked up President in History in 2012!

11-03-2011, 06:27 PM	#21
GunMaster357 Professor Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Brest (FRANCE) Posts: 1,837	Correct me if I'm wrong but the USA do have other political parties. It is the indirect election system that prevents most of them to come to the front. http://www.politics1.com/parties.htm __________________ "War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." - Ambrose Bierce

11-03-2011, 10:04 AM	#16
SamIam Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Not here Posts: 2,655	Me three. The last time a third party won the White House it was back at the turn of the last century when Teddy Roosevelt and his Bull Moose party took the White House by storm. Bully! I'd like to see a party that actually represented the American people for a change, but the chances of that are slim.

11-03-2011, 06:52 PM	#22
Lamplighter Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Bottom lands of the Missoula floods Posts: 6,402	Yes, of course. Probably ~ 50 The US was formed as a republic (representative government), while France came in as closer to a democracy. But, third parties just don't succeed, here or elsewhere... they end up as coalitions, with a minority holding excessive power via threats to move to the other side. Remember Italy just a few years ago... elections every other week because coalitions would form and dissolve over small issues. To my eye, it's up the the Republican's+TeaParty's to decide what the Republican party is going to be. Then, it's up to voters to decide which party has their best interests at heart.

11-03-2011, 07:53 PM	#26
Lamplighter Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Bottom lands of the Missoula floods Posts: 6,402	A Constitutional Amendment requirement on every ballot issue: None of the Above (_X_)

11-03-2011, 08:33 PM	#28
HungLikeJesus Only looks like a disaster tourist Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: above 7,000 feet Posts: 7,208	What if we just got rid of political parties all together? __________________ Keep Your Bodies Off My Lawn SteveDallas's Random Thread Picker.

11-03-2011, 08:36 PM	#29
SamIam Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Not here Posts: 2,655	Hah! What if we just got rid of politicians all together? Last edited by SamIam; 11-03-2011 at 08:36 PM. Reason: typo

11-03-2011, 09:03 PM	#30
Lamplighter Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Bottom lands of the Missoula floods Posts: 6,402	A basic question... If ALL politicians are bad, were they bad before they were elected ? That is, does it take a certain internal "bad-ness" for a person to work their way up through the civic organization offices (e.g., PTA), County, State, and then Federal. Or is it primarily the degradation of holding public office that erodes the person. I've worked in State governments and found most State employees were trying and actually did do a good job, but the public view of government workers is really poor.

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