Guns don't kill people ....

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Ibram

in my American Judicial Process class at the community college of vermont a couple weeks ago, we were dealing with a case where a 14 year old kid shot a man who was in their house to have sex with his bipolar, possibly schizophrenic, unmedicated mother who thought a family lived under their trailer and pulled out all the insulation, freezing their pipes and cutting off their running water. The kid said that the man had to leave because his mother didn't know what she was doing and couldn't consent, the man didn't, the kid brandished his shotgun, the man attacked him, the kid shot him.
I raised the point that nobody questioned that a 14-year-old owned and kept his own shotgun.
The class just kind of went, um, yeah, its vermont, why the hell wouldn't a 14-year-old have his own shotgun?

GD Genius you are.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by footfootfoot

How about Broccoli Raab? Is it all Cruciferous vegetables?

Just don't try to regulate it!

[ZenGum]

Two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. We're not sure about the universe.

Teenagers hurt in Victorian hunting accident

Two teenagers are in a serious condition in hospital after a shotgun accident in central Victoria.

The accident happened in the small town of Majorca in central Victoria just before midday.

Police say the two boys, aged 14 and 15, were with a 48-year-old man who was rabbit shooting at the time of the accident.

It is believed they were accidentally shot when they walked up a ridge and into the man's path as he was firing on an animal.

The pellets caused serious injuries to the face, chest and body of the 15-year-old boy.

The 14-year-old boy also suffered chest and arm injuries.

They were both flown to the Royal Children's Hospital in Melbourne.

For "It is believed they were accidentally shot when they walked up a ridge and into the man's path as he was firing on an animal"
please read
"It is believed they were accidentally shot when the man fired on an animal too close to the ridge line without sufficient backstop. Dumbarse."

I have never owned a gun or gun license, and never fired anything bigger than an air rifle, but even I know this rule.

[sexobon]

Were they wearing hoodies that might have made them look like trophy rabbits?

[classicman]

^^^FTW^^^

[Lamplighter]

Seven more + three wounded by one gunman.

GO, go, go NRA

Fox News
April 03, 2012

Students hid as gunman opened fire small Christian school in California; 7 dead

OAKLAND, California – *One wounded woman cowered in the bushes
after the gunman opened fire on the campus of a small Christian university in California
One student hid in a locked classroom as the shooter banged on the door.

Within an hour's time Monday, police said, a 43-year-old former student named One L. Goh
walked into Oikos University and began a rampage that left seven people dead and three people wounded,
trapped some in the building and forced others to flee for their lives.
<snip>

[classicman]

About 115 people die every day in vehicle crashes in the United States
GO, go, go UAW!

[Ibby]

Lamp: would tighter gun laws have prevented that? How MUCH tighter? Assuming that a British style no-guns proposal would be unconstitutional, and barring repealing the second amendment... What do you propose as a solution?

[Ibby]

To be honest, while most pro-gun arguments that assume "more people with guns means less crime!" don't quite check out 100% to me, mass shootings like this are one of the few cases where I definitely think that MORE gun ownership would limit the casualties in massacre situations.

[piercehawkeye45]

Gun crime is tied to gun culture, not number of guns. In some areas, more guns means more deaths. In some areas, more guns means less deaths.

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by Ibram

Lamp: would tighter gun laws have prevented that? How MUCH tighter?
Assuming that a British style no-guns proposal would be unconstitutional, and barring repealing the second amendment...
What do you propose as a solution?

My short answer is: Yes, tighter gun laws could prevent that sort of massacre.
What do I propose as a solution ? That's a longer discussion.

I've invited the so-called pro-gun Dwellars to answer the same sort of question
and not surprisingly there's been no response.
They know this sort of thing is happening, but choose to do/say nothing about it.

That's not surprising because right now the interpretation of the 2nd Amendment is to their favor.
The NRA is running with it, and lobbying feverishly to pass their manly "Stand Your Ground" laws.
Just the name of that law makes the weak feel strong.

Personally, and contrary to what Lookout123 has assumed, I have no problem with guns, per se,
I have owned them since high school, and still have one.

As policy, I have no problem with guns used for hunting, either for meat or trophy
--- so long as the hunt is "fair chase".
As policy, I have no problem with guns (or CCL's) issued when the individual's job or
career presents a need for one, i.e., as an agent in busines that needs protection.
(e.g., as an agent for a bank or $-guard, body guard, criminal attorney, etc.)

I do have a problem with every Joe Blow citizen, like my next door neighbor, having a gun
just because he lives in fear that someone somewhere might do something he doesn't like.

I put the blame where the fault lies... with the ATA and the NRA.
It is my belief about the way things are going due to the current interpretation
of the 2nd Amendment, that society will eventually recognize that the argument
about "self defense" is fallacious, and the fact that guns are doing unjustifiable harm to individuals and to society, itself.

When that happens, the judicial interpretation of the 2nd Amendment will change,
and guns be allowed in specific light of maintaining a well-regulated militia (e.g., National Guard)
only as necessary for the security of the free state, and not to feed the politics of the NRA.
.

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by classicman

About 115 people die every day in vehicle crashes in the United States
GO, go, go UAW!

Once again, fuzzy logic.

Do away with the UAW, and cars would still be made, and accidents would still happen at the same rates.
Do away with the NRA, and gun control laws would be passed, and the rate of killings would decrease,
... maybe even down to that of auto accidents.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Lamplighter

Do away with the NRA, and gun control laws would be passed, and the rate of killings would decrease...

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

My short answer is: Yes, tighter gun laws could prevent that sort of massacre.
What do I propose as a solution ? That's a longer discussion.

I've invited the so-called pro-gun Dwellars to answer the same sort of question
and not surprisingly there's been no response.
They know this sort of thing is happening, but choose to do/say nothing about it.

[sexobon]

Originally Posted by Lamplighter

... I've invited the so-called pro-gun Dwellars to answer the same sort of question
and not surprisingly there's been no response.
They know this sort of thing is happening, but choose to do/say nothing about it.

Lamplighter, to me there are two glaring reasons why the matters you're presenting haven't gotten the response you'd like:

1. First and foremost, we're 270 posts into this thread and YOU DIDN'T BRING ANY SNACKS!

2. Similar issues have been raised and done to death here before, prior to you joining the community (e.g. Will the Second Amendment survive?, 12-02-2007 to 01-06-2008, 22 pages, 326 posts). Many of the previous participants are still here. Some have chimed in this time around for various reasons including probing just to see where the newer members stand on the issues. Many are not getting involved to the same degree as before, if at all, and why should they? They're under no obligation to rehash their perspectives just to appease more recent members. Unless you've read through all of the previous topically related posts in all of the previous topically related threads, I believe the part of your quote I've put in bold does the membership an injustice.