The Obamanation

[piercehawkeye45]

Grunwald is an obvious Obama supporter but his arguments at least make logical sense. Long but interesting read.


Think Again: Obama's New Deal
The president's Republican critics are dead wrong. The stimulus worked.

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/article..._deal?page=0,0


Edit: Well apparently he is writing a book on the topic...
http://www.amazon.com/The-New-Deal-M...5200283&sr=1-1

[xoxoxoBruce]

Gruwald says the stimulus saved us from a second great depression.
If that's true, then it was a bad thing. It appears that's what it will take to get people to wake the fuck up to what's been going on for the last 30 years. Apparently there are still too many people doing too well, to create enough interest in straightening congress out.

[SamIam]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Gruwald says the stimulus saved us from a second great depression.
If that's true, then it was a bad thing. It appears that's what it will take to get people to wake the fuck up to what's been going on for the last 30 years. Apparently there are still too many people doing too well, to create enough interest in straightening congress out.

There's enough people doing really, really, really well who want to preserve the status quo and retain their immunity from the laws the rest of us are expected to follow. Wealthy tea party members establish PAC's to get their right wing wacko candidates elected. Upper echelon members of the government routinely smooth the way for lucrative contracts for large companies whose CEO's have deep pockets - deep pockets to keep the money flowing to the correct party and candidates. Naturally, these CEO's can do whatever they feel like and no one raises so much as an eyebrow.

Convert to the Church of the Latter Day Saints now and avoid the rush.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Not only the "people doing really, really, really well", there are a shitload of people not doing as well as they were, but still employed, hanging on, and getting by. They're scared because the know if they lose their job they're well and truly fucked, so they don't want to rock the boat. They'll likely plug their ears, say nanananana, and vote for the party they always voted for.

It will take a real depression to piss these people off enough to clean house. The Teaparty played to the disgruntled mood of the country with congress, but see who it attracted. People that were comparatively well off, and not pissed off enough to really think about who they were voting for. How else would you explain Christine O'Donnell in Delaware.

[SamIam]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Not only the "people doing really, really, really well", there are a shitload of people not doing as well as they were, but still employed, hanging on, and getting by. They're scared because the know if they lose their job they're well and truly fucked, so they don't want to rock the boat. They'll likely plug their ears, say nanananana, and vote for the party they always voted for.

It will take a real depression to piss these people off enough to clean house. The Teaparty played to the disgruntled mood of the country with congress, but see who it attracted. People that were comparatively well off, and not pissed off enough to really think about who they were voting for. How else would you explain Christine O'Donnell in Delaware.

Lacking cable or even a TV, I had to look up O'Donnell on the net. I like this quote of hers in 2007 on the O'Reilly Factor. O'Donnell said, "American scientific companies are cross-breeding humans and animals and coming up with mice with fully functioning human brains. So they’re already into this experiment.”

Where's Mickey when we need him?

The fact that people actually vote for her shows just how ignorant and intolerant American voters have become. The far right is engaging in what amounts to the politics of hatred. I think that as much as anything influences Joe Six Pack when he enters the polling booth. I don't know if a deepening economic crisis would influence old Joe much. If he lost his job, he'd probably blame the flag burners in Congress who oppose giving big corporations even more tax breaks than they already get, pander to "welfare queens," and won't give the little guy a break by cutting taxes on the wealthy. Surely all those rich people who suddenly have extra money would use it to buy fancy items at the hardware store Joe was laid off from.

What Joe refuses to understand is that big corporations use their tax breaks to give zillion dollar raises to their CEO's - not create new jobs; that welfare queens actually constitute only about 20% of those who receive assistance from social programs - 80% of the beneficiaries of these programs are the elderly and the disabled; and the rich bitch from the snappy gated community was already buying her gold faucets from some chic overseas outfit and would never be caught dead in Joe's hardware shop.

Americans today are ignorant and mean and they scare me.

[piercehawkeye45]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

Not only the "people doing really, really, really well", there are a shitload of people not doing as well as they were, but still employed, hanging on, and getting by. They're scared because the know if they lose their job they're well and truly fucked, so they don't want to rock the boat. They'll likely plug their ears, say nanananana, and vote for the party they always voted for.

It will take a real depression to piss these people off enough to clean house. The Teaparty played to the disgruntled mood of the country with congress, but see who it attracted. People that were comparatively well off, and not pissed off enough to really think about who they were voting for. How else would you explain Christine O'Donnell in Delaware.

I don't disagree with you but I don't know if people will just "wake up" if the situation gets bad enough. It would be the hopeful possibility but xenophobia et al. is the other option, which would just make a horrible situation worse. Many genocides (Rwanda and Nazi's for example) are the result of populations getting pushed to the edge and taking it out on people who had no control over the situation in the first place.

[xoxoxoBruce]

I don't know if people will just wake up if the situation gets worse either. But I've already seen they won't if it doesn't. I was being optimistic, but you could very well be right. If you are, that would solve the unemployment problem. Lots of jobs opening up suddenly and undertakers hiring.

[SamIam]

Originally Posted by piercehawkeye45

I don't disagree with you but I don't know if people will just "wake up" if the situation gets bad enough. It would be the hopeful possibility but xenophobia et al. is the other option, which would just make a horrible situation worse. Many genocides (Rwanda and Nazi's for example) are the result of populations getting pushed to the edge and taking it out on people who had no control over the situation in the first place.

Excellent point. I would also like to point out that American culture and society has undergone a major sea change since the depression era in the 30's. At the time of the great depression a much higher percentage of Americans lived in rural areas. The small family farm where the plowing was done with a mule could still to be found all over the country. If you live in a rural area you have fewer neighbors and you come to know the ones you do have well. They may have shared the boundary of your back 40 for generations. People helped one another out as a matter of course. You might help Joe out with the haying, but he could just as well be over at your place someday, helping to rebuild your barn that was lost in a fire. It was far easier for the Americans of that era to understand the importance of helping their fellow countrymen in a time of dire need.

Today's America is a highly urbanized place. Everybody tends to reside in the big city where you can live next door to someone for years and never even know their name. If you happen to have a flat tire on a busy city street, people are more likely to honk their horns in irritation than they are to stop and help you change your tire. Everyone is anonymous. The sense of community and shared hardship does not exist. If someone loses their job or their home they probably deserved it because (pick one) they were the wrong color or spoke with the wrong accent or they lacked the good old American work ethic or they were faking the condition that rendered them disabled. Etc. ect., ect.

Today's America values wealth and priviledge above all else. "He who dies with the most toys wins." Taxation is considered a form of slavery by the tea party because they'd prefer to spend that money on a new Mercedes rather than contribute to the shared fund which maintains our highways and the rest of our national infrastructure.

Today's America always seems to be involved in some undeclared war in some country that most Americans know little about and absolutely nothing about what is really going on. The all volunteer military allows Americans to shrug their shoulders with the comment that those who serve in our armed forces signed on for it. This national state of denial is abetted by the rule that no pictures be taken of the caskets of the dead that are returned daily to our shores. These men and women gave their lives for a country that wants to pretend they never existed. How ironic is that?

Government spending on ever newer and ever better weapons of death is a sacred cow that no one will touch. Just as no one will touch our veterans either. The VA continues to be the target of budget slashers. Our veterans have served their purpose and those who have deep wounds of the body or spirit are useless. We relegate them to city parks and over crowded homeless shelters, and should we pass one on the street, we refuse to meet his eyes.

Today's America is looking into the abyss and the abyss is looking back.

[Lamplighter]

From my post here last March

Under the agreement, the banks will provide principal relief and other
borrower assistance valued at $17 billion. In addition, roughly $5 billion
of the settlement will be paid in fines, while $3 billion will be used to help
refinancing for homeowners who owe more than their homes are worth.
The deal also includes new mortgage-servicing standards.

Today, the first preliminary report was made public...

NY Times
By SHAILA DEWAN
Published: August 29, 2012

Homeowners See Benefits in Bank Plan

More than 130,000 homeowners have received $10.5 billion in relief
under the national settlement over foreclosure abuses, according to
a preliminary report issued Wednesday by the settlement monitor.

Under the settlement in February, reached in response to evidence
that the foreclosure process had been riddled with fraud,
the country’s five largest mortgage servicers promised $25 billion
to help stem the tide of homeowner losses.

About $20 billion of that was to be in relief to homeowners,
primarily through various forms of debt forgiveness.
Although it may seem that banks have already satisfied more
than half of their commitment, only a portion of the $10.5 billion
will count, because of the way the relief is tallied.

The banks — Ally Financial, Bank of America, Citigroup, JPMorgan Chase and Wells Fargo
— reported that the bulk of the help so far had come in the form of short sales,
in which lenders allow homeowners to sell for less than what they owe.
Many homeowners have been stuck in their homes because they have lost so much value.
The banks reported $8.7 billion in debt written off through short sales.
<SNIP>

[ZenGum]

So this "relief" consists of losing your house and walking away with nothing, but at least they don't keep chasing you for more? Thanks, banks.

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by ZenGum

So this "relief" consists of losing your house and walking away with nothing,
but at least they don't keep chasing you for more? Thanks, banks.

Ummm... I don't think I would describe it that way.

The article also talks about some of the foreclosures being settled
by "home equity loans", while others were "short sales".

I think this would mean that for those owners who had significant equity
(e.g., more than 20% of loan-to-value), they could end up staying in their homes,
and paying a reduced monthly payment (but probably at a higher interest rate).

The short sales were likely the people who became "owners" with very little down payment.
For them, they had little/no equity in the property, and so lived in the house
while making mortgage payments that were essentially all interest.
(aka "rent")
For these people, I would say they essentially had nothing to walk away from,
but they preserved their credit ratings, and maybe some dignity.

The people who were really screwed by all this were those whose foreclosures
had already been completed, and they had been forced off of their property.
They lost their home, their credit rating, and many other valuables.
And the maximum they received from this "settlement" was $2,000.

[Lamplighter]

And the beat goes on...


NY Journal
9/28/12

Bank of America to Pay $2.43 Billion to Settle Suit Over Merrill Deal

Bank of America announced on Friday that it would pay $2.43 billion
to settle a class action lawsuit related to its acquisition of Merrill Lynch,
as the legal woes continue for the financial institution.
<snip>

Early in the financial crisis, Bank of America looked to be one of the winners.
As other banks struggled to stay afloat, the firm swooped in to buy
Countrywide Financial, the mortgage lender, in 2008.
Later that year, Bank of America agreed to purchase Merrill Lynch, the beleaguered investment bank.
But both deals are proving to be a legal albatross.

Countrywide’s mortgage problems have weighed on profits for awhile.
In the second quarter of 2011, the bank reported an $8.8 billion loss,
mainly related to a settlement with mortgage investors.

Earlier this year, Bank of America and four other banks agreed to a
$26 billion settlement related to their foreclosure practices.
Now, it faces a similar burden from the Merrill Lynch deal.
Bank of America said it would take a $1.6 billion hit related to the settlement
and other legal expenses.

And this too...

NY Times
STEVEN M. DAVIDOFF
9/27/12
A $50 Billion Claim of Havoc Looms for Bank of America
<snip>
This episode also spawned a lawsuit from the Securities and Exchange Commission
that Bank of America, Mr. Lewis and Joseph Price, the former chief financial officer,
settled for $150 million.

Judge Jed S. Rakoff of the Federal District Court in Manhattan approved the deal
but complained that it didn’t sufficiently penalize the individuals involved.
The amount was paid by Bank of America with no liability for Mr. Lewis or Mr. Price.
Judge Rakoff called the settlement “half-baked justice at best.”
Judge Rakoff may see his wish for greater penalties granted.
The New York attorney general’s office has a lawsuit on the matter.<snip>

[Lamplighter]

Yes, the beat goes on...


Wall Street Journal
JEAN EAGLESHAM And DAN FITZPATRICK
10/01/12

J.P. Morgan Sued on Mortgage Bonds

New York's top prosecutor filed a civil complaint against J.P. Morgan Chase Co.,
alleging widespread fraud by the company's Bear Stearns unit in the sale
of mortgage-backed securities in the run-up to the financial crisis.

Eric Schneiderman, New York's attorney general, filed the civil lawsuit
in New York state court Monday. The case is the first brought under the aegis of
a law enforcement group that was formed by President Barack Obama in January
to pursue alleged wrongdoing related to the financial crisis.

More cases from the group are expected to follow.
"We intend to follow up with similar actions against other sponsors and underwriters of RMBS,"
said an official in the attorney general's office.

The allegations relate to billions of dollars of subprime securities
issued by Bear Stearns Cos. before the troubled firm, now owned by J.P.Morgan, collapsed in 2008.
The suit alleges that losses on residential-mortgage securities issued by Bear Stearns
in 2006 and 2007 alone were "astounding," totaling $22.5 billion, or more than a quarter
of the original principal balance. The action asks that the company be made to pay
an undisclosed amount of damages "caused, directly or indirectly, by the fraudulent and deceptive acts."

New York's attorney general filed a civil complaint against J.P. Morgan Chase alleging
widespread fraud in the sale of mortgage-backed securities in the run-up to the financial crisis.
<snip>

[richlevy]

From here

I agree with this guy. Frankly, I'm embarrassed by the rudeness of the opposition in this country.

here was a time not so long ago when Americans, regardless of their political stripes, rallied round their president. Once elected, the man who won the White House was no longer viewed as a republican or democrat, but the President of the United States. The oath of office was taken, the wagons were circled around the country’s borders and it was America versus the rest of the world with the president of all the people at the helm.

The health-care debate, which looked more like extreme fighting in a mud pit than a national dialogue, revealed a very vulgar side of America. President Obama’s face appeared on protest signs white-faced and blood-mouthed in a satanic clown image. In other tasteless portrayals, people who disagreed with his position distorted his face to look like Hitler complete with mustache and swastika.
Odd, that burning the flag makes Americans crazy, but depicting the president as a clown and a maniacal fascist is accepted as part of the new rude America.

[classicman]

...regardless of their political stripes, rallied round their president. Once elected, the man who won the White House was no longer viewed as a republican or democrat, but the President of the United States.

Still many who feel that way regardless of what this crappy POS site says.
Here's the link http://theobamadiary.com/tag/hes/

And there are PLENTY of pics of Bush and virtually every president since the 50's with some sort of Hitler reference. Bush did get a movie made about him being assassinated too. To say that this crap started with Obama is Bullshit.