Okay, but no. What kind of car should *I* buy?

[footfootfoot]

27x60=1620. Is that a good price?

[lumberjim]

Originally Posted by glatt

And this is offered only for new cars? Or is there some version for used cars, that is priced appropriately and with enough sneaky exemptions that they still make a profit?

that list is for used only. the new cars are also divided by class by model as i listed above.

this class guide gets you into the right section of the cost guide.... then the miles that are on the car when it's sold get you to the right row in that section... then how long a plan you want is the column.... the cost is at the intersection. there are 3 levels of coverage... powertrain only, a mid level(power equipment motors, a/c, major suspension cooling fuel parts... but no radios or bluetooth or nav type stuff), and exclusionary coverage ( they tell you what is NOT covered, and everything else IS.. this is commonly referred to as bumper to bumper)
we can mark them up as we like. typically I open people up between $600 and $1200 over and see where it takes us.

Originally Posted by footfootfoot

27x60=1620. Is that a good price?

that is a fictitious price... and it was for 72, babe

[tw]

Originally Posted by lumberjim

I think he might have actually agreed with my point about companies offering longer or more involved warranties in order to compensate for some other short coming.

Only a fool buys insurance to supplement the warranty. It is priced so that you always end up paying more. Similar to going to a casino to get rich.

If a car is so unreliable as to need supplementary insurance, then why waste money on it?

Supplemental warranty insurance is irrelevant to the topic: a relationship between a manufacturer's warranty and product reliability. Longer manufacturer warranties claiming to cover more indentify unreliable products.

Charts for supplemental coverage are irrelevant to the manufacturer's warranty. And completely irrelevant to what was discussed. If the manufacture hypes a best warranty, then his products is typically unreliable. In the end, costing the consumer more money (with or without supplemental warranty insurance).

[sexobon]

Tw@,

The gist of the thread changed when F3 decided to shop for a used car rather than a new one. Being discussed was the pricing of third party warranties available for purchase on used cars as a reflection of repair record and indicator of reliability. While others were discussing this, you were still going on about new car warranties. That’s why xoB twice said zoom, over his head about you. That should have been an indicator that you missed the transfer and were no longer on the right train. F3 bought a 2004 Hyundai Sonata.

[tw]

Originally Posted by sexobon

Being discussed was the pricing of third party warranties available for purchase on used cars as a reflection of repair record and indicator of reliability.

Why would anyone buy a third party warranty? Why spend money for no purpose? No sense is providing some third party with a healthy profit.

Purpose of insurance is to avert a cash flow problem. Anybody risking backruptcy because a car fails really should address a fiscal problem first. Useful warranty comes free from the manufacturer (and from better dealers who actually fix used cars before selling them).

If a dealer is pushing additional warranties, well, that also implies a problem. Better is to consider other probably more responsible dealers. A big buck and hyped warranty is often associated with a reliability problem.

[glatt]

Originally Posted by tw

Anybody risking backruptcy because a car fails really should address a fiscal problem first.

Interesting that you wrote that.

You would think this would be true, but it's not. At least not in reality. Economists recently have been studying the idea of scarcity and how it causes desperate people to make poor decisions. (I'm NOT talking about footfootfoot here.) The idea is that if you don't know where the money for your next meal is coming from, the last thing in the world you are going to do is to come up with a plan to improve your economic future. You're not going to enroll in a class or something so you can make more money next year if you are busy worrying about how to feed yourself tonight. Poor people are stuck in a feedback loop of bad choices because they can't get get ahead long enough to to plan for the future.

If you are buying a used car, chances are you aren't in a financial position to get a new one. You probably also aren't in a position to pay a huge repair bill if something major goes wrong. A supplemental warranty is a known expense each month that can be budgeted. Yes, it's probably going to lose you money in the long run. These insurance companies aren't dumb. But it's a known fixed expense that will allow you to buy a car without having a big nest egg in case the thing craps out on you.

[Clodfobble]

Not to mention the fact that in 85% of US cities (see what I did there?) you can't address a fiscal problem without a job, and you can't hold a job without a car.

[lumberjim]

That's exactly right. And if you get a good plan for a good price, you can "beat the buffet"

I broke even on the blue jeep, and came out ahead on the commander. A $800 transmission job with 40 miles left on my contract put it over the top... But the timing of that repair... I got it fixed the day before I drove it to Charlotte NC.
I had to buy a new cell phone that same day because I didn't get the coverage on that... It would have been brutal if I had to cough up all that money at that time.

Fear of that happening is often what motivates people to get them. 70% of my used car customers get them. I make it hard to decline. I want people to get them even if I have to cut the price to $100 over cost. I'll always ask them to pay heavy , but if they say no 3 times, that fourth offer will be a break even for me.

If you have no coverage and the car breaks, you're either taking it to a shop that charges less than dealer labor rates, or fixing it yourself. Most people can't do the latter. Look at what glatt just went through diagnosing and hopefully fixing his camry...

All things being equal, I'd rather have the work happen in our shop, paid by the service contract... Give you a rental while it's fixed, you stay happy, we stay friends, you buy more cars here. Win win win. Maybe you even get in the habit of doing routine maintenence with us.

Some times people just don't want to hear it though, and pass on really good offers.

Sometimes you find out that they are in the shop with a $2085 PCM repair, and have to show them the waiver they signed with the contract price at $1895. They remember discussing it, but don't remember if they got the coverage.

Hindsight etc. Maybe next time you should consider the coverage. I actually felt bad for that lady. And she's probably gonna look at some different options, next car she buys.. Lose lose.

[glatt]

I vaguely remember the guy talking to us about the coverage when we bought the Camry, but this place was an hour away even though it was only about 10 miles away. I never wanted to go there again. Brutal stop and go traffic. Red lights out of sync the whole way there. We declined without even thinking about the numbers.

[lumberjim]

Oh... I was talking to that lady with the big bill , not you, glatt... Although when I re read it, it does seem like I was saying you should have. ... Except... Um.... Spark plug wires are never covered, lol.

[tw]

Originally Posted by glatt

Economists recently have been studying the idea of scarcity and how it causes desperate people to make poor decisions.

Described is what was called a 'cash flow' problem. It is why hedge funds were originally created. And why some need a car loan. A short term fix hoping the long term (and more expensive) bills can be paid later. If a cash flow problem does not exist, then a supplemental warranty is similar to playing 21 to get rich.

Supplemental warranty insurance is priced so that a financial instituion will make a significant profit. Odds are priced so the house wins.

A cash flow problem makes poor decisions necessary. For most, supplemental warranty insurance makes no sense.

[orthodoc]

Gee, tw, could you be any more of an asshole? 'A cash flow problem makes poor decisions necessary.' No. A cash flow problem mandates certain decisions/approaches that you obviously have no experience with. Lucky you. I had a cash flow problem in university: I had no money to pay my rent. Not my fault. My parents, who had sufficient income, chose to spend it on other things, and I didn't qualify for loans.

Did I make 'poor' decisions? No, I made the ones that let me survive. Others have explained the upside of being able to budget for a monthly expense rather than an enormous, unexpected repair bill. To forgo the supplemental warranty and bet that nothing will happen until enough money is put aside to cover a huge repair expense is not rational. That expense is as likely to happen soon as later. Your argument is moot.

But I refuse to play by your 'rules'. You are also an asshole. You clearly don't care, but don't accuse others of being 'emotional' or less than adult to cover up your own deficiencies of thought and experience.

[tw]

Originally Posted by orthodoc

Gee, tw, could you be any more of an asshole? 'A cash flow problem makes poor decisions necessary.' No. A cash flow problem mandates certain decisions/approaches that you obviously have no experience with.

Those decisions typically are short term and necessary with long term adverse consequences. Poor decisions. Anyone who has been in that position can appreciate that a cash flow problem (ie poverty) means life's expenses increase. Those poor decisions must be made, in part, because no alternative exist.

Thing that must be done end up, in the long term, costing significantly more money. Also called poor decisions that cannot be avoided. Also called a poverty trap. Explained is why poverty is so hard to get out of. Why do you have ignorance of the downtrodden?

Once in poverty, then things cost more. Including fees to cash a welfare or paycheck. Poor decisions.

Payday loans, a car loan, etc are all bad decisions that the poorest are force to make. Poor decisions that are difficult to avoid when in poverty. Clearly you have never been there.

At least I demonstrate sympathy for those with cash flow problems. You, instead, post obscenities like Lumberjim on his high horse. Why do you show so much contempt for one who clearly demonstrates sympathy for the downtrodden? Shame on you.

I suspect you might not be feeling well. Therefore did not grasp what I really posted. Maybe you want to reconsider your outburst.

[glatt]

So tw, how does this most recent post fit with your comment that "Anybody risking backruptcy because a car fails really should address a fiscal problem first."

You admit that the "poor" are stuck in a desperate situation that causes them to make decisions that will probably work against them in the long run. How are they supposed to "address their fiscal problem first," when they need to buy a car to get to work? And they need to make sure the car will be reliable, so they buy the warranty because they have no large nest egg.

You seem to be arguing against yourself.

[lumberjim]

Hes clearly just trolling at this point. It's gotten rather flagrant lately tw.