Questions of Rendell

Chewbaccus · 05-20-2002, 01:04 PM

Now, as the elders of this hallowed institution have, for reasons known only to them, stayed in Philadelphia for extended periods of time, I think it only fair I post this question to them:

How shady was Rendell, really?

~mike

Undertoad · 05-20-2002, 01:34 PM

Not shady at all, especially in comparison to every Philadelphia mayorship before and since. And with the fact that he had to push out some deeply powerful unions in order to privatize, you'd think it would have been much, much worse.

Rendell's one of the finer pols going. Casey Jr. (his opponent for the D governors primary here) is an empty suit whose reign as Auditor General was marked by Nothing Much. The only time he ever got big press was in criticizing the Philadelphia shipyard deal -- a spit at then-Gov. Tom Ridge and future opponent Rendell. But he criticized it two years after the hands were shook, so it was meaningless and totally political.

I urge you to vote Rendell if you have the opportunity.

MaggieL · 05-20-2002, 02:44 PM

Rendell has made one move that may have been a serious mistake: by taking a position for expanding gun control in the state, he's alienated a lot of folks outside the Democratic strongholds in the big cities. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

Undertoad · 05-20-2002, 02:59 PM

Yes, as soon as one single-issue gun rights voter considers doing something other than pulling the straight R lever, that will become important.

Undertoad · 05-20-2002, 03:07 PM

OK, on second thought, that's unfair. There are maybe 5% single-issue voters who would *consider* voting for a D over an R, but the multi-issue voters can be swayed at a greater rate.

Undertoad · 05-20-2002, 03:19 PM

One other thing for Pennsylvania Ds: don't be fooled into voting for Lawless for Lt. Governor. The guy should be returned to private live A.S.A.P. In my opinion.

elSicomoro · 05-20-2002, 06:02 PM

I didn't want to vote for Rendell just b/c he's from Philadelphia. By the time I moved here, the Village Idiot was in charge (John Street).

Casey seems to be trading on his father's name, and I definitely don't like his positions on abortion and the minimum wage. I like Rendell's background as D.A. and Mayor, I like his stances, and I particularly like the persona, in that he seems to walk his own walk. Fumo hates him (Fumo's a tool), Street seems cold to him (also a tool), and Ed pissed people off in the Democratic Party (while he was running it no less) with the election aftermath. Yep, I gotta go with big Ed.

Incidentally, this will be my first PA election. I didn't register early enough for the Presidential election, and this is the first place I've lived in which you do not receive a notice by mail for voting. My bad.

But, with a Daily News in hand, I now know where I go to vote in my neighborhood. (The beer distributor had no Inkys, and I wanted to read the little debate Smerconish was having with a city resident...it's an interesting piece.)

elSicomoro · 05-20-2002, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Undertoad
One other thing for Pennsylvania Ds: don't be fooled into voting for Lawless for Lt. Governor. The guy should be returned to private live A.S.A.P. In my opinion.

Gee Tony, you didn't run across him in your political days, did you?

For what it's worth, I have no idea who he is, other than his stupid ad on TV, with what I would call the "stereotypical" Philadelphian at the end. To me, the Lt. Governor position is there as a just-in-case situation (like what happened here in PA this year, and in MO 2 years ago). I mean, what do they really do? I had no clue Schweiker was Lt. Gov. when Ridge left, and I only know MD's b/c she's a Kennedy (and will probably win the Governorship there in the next election).

MaggieL · 05-20-2002, 10:29 PM

Note that at no point do they actually claim that Lawless *is* a Philadelphian....only that he *knows* Philly, with a lot of symbolic claptrap. He isn't a Philly boy...he's local to Tony and my neck of the woods in western Montgomery County; as far as I can see he's never actually lived in the city proper. He was in fact a local rabble rouser who was elected to the state house as a Republican but who switched affiliations last year.

Undertoad · 05-20-2002, 10:59 PM

I ran across him, yeah, several times. But here are two stories that basically sum this guy up.

Lawless made a big deal about how prisoners in state prisons get cable TV cheap because the prisons negotiate bulk deals with the cable franchises. After a few weeks of ranting and raving on the topic, Lawless finally visited Graterford, the local state lock-up. After seeing how things are there, and having the warden explain that he liked the prisoners having cable because it keeps them occupied and thus not raping and killing each other, Lawless basically slunk away quietly.

Lawless hates the state college system and spends a lot of time messing with it. The last time he took an interest, he heard that Penn State students were scheduling a "sex faire" -- basically, a mostly-harmless informational event that they decided to put on. Figuring he could incilte media coverage and get free publicity, Lawless put out press releases and such, tracking them down to ensure that they weren't using any state funds to put on the event. When they held it on campus, Lawless demanded that the event be banned and students held responsible because some extra money must have gone to maintenance and janitorial costs because of it.

russotto · 05-21-2002, 02:40 PM

I don't know, Tony; that first Lawless story actually puts him above most politicians. Most wouldn't care what the actual situation at the prison was, just how good the sound bite sounded.

As for Rendell... ugh. I remember Schaefer in MD. Considered a decent Mayor, but earned the title Governor of Baltimore for his antics in that office. And as a non-Philadelphian, I'd be concerned that he'd raise taxes statewide to throw funds at Philadelphia.

Hubris Boy · 05-21-2002, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sycamore
I only know MD's b/c she's a Kennedy (and will probably win the Governorship there in the next election).

We're doing all we can to prevent that from happening.

Undertoad · 05-21-2002, 05:49 PM

Anyway, on seeing the turnout at our local precinct, Rendell is sure to win this thing, and the Casey era may be over. Which would be a great thing.

Y'see, the only reason Casey Sr. won was because he had a certain Democratic strategist on his side: one James Carville. They concocted and ran a last-minute ad attacking their Republican opponent for his teenage indulgence in Transcendental Meditation, and won.

It was an incredible ad. It was the lowest thing I have ever seen. They found pics of the guy in long hair on his college campus and blew them up for the screen. Fake newspaper headlines, scary professional announcer, the whole nine yards. And it was utterly effective, scaring the public silly and causing them to vote for Casey Sr. as the very last minute.

I mean the whole thing was timed perfectly. The ad ran the weekend before the election. There was no time for reporters to get a reaction, no time for editorial writers to write about it or question it.

The Casey Sr. victory made Carville the rising star of political consultants, eventually leading to his management, and victory, of the campaign of Clinton '92.

The Casey Sr. victory also created political shockwaves when they wondered whether there was a new streak of Democrats who were pro-life. There weren't; it was just a big loser, who should have lost but for the meanest, most vicious campaign manager ever to walk the earth.

elSicomoro · 05-21-2002, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hubris Boy
We're doing all we can to prevent that from happening.

*laughs* Good luck on that.

Okay, so I got to use this new machine today. A bit confusing at first, but overall, I'd say it's a vast improvement. The flashing red lights could cause seizures though.

However, the vote itself has confused me on one issue. I was under the impression that the redistricting in PA was ruled unconstitutional by the PA Supreme Court. Yet, my section of Philadelphia has now been thrown into the 13th district, and my option for Congress was Joe Hoeffel. Anyone with insight on this? Does that redistricting currently stand until the map is redrawn?

Now to the amusing, which would be the "Official Democratic Ballot" presented by our friends at the Phila. Democratic City Committee. Their choice for guv was Casey. The chairman of this committee is Congressman Bob Brady. The treasurer is John Dougherty.

Even I don't want to see money thrown into the city by the state. But behind the scenes, a Rendell win could be huge not only for Philadelphia, but for SE Pennsylvania as a whole. And besides, it would be fun to see Perzel, Fumo, and Big Ed mix it up.

Undertoad · 05-21-2002, 06:13 PM

It WAS ruled unconstitutional, but then somehow someone also ruled that there wasn't enough time to draw up a new plan in time for the primaries, and that hysteria would reign. So they decided that they would just go with the new plan for this election, and then draw up a new new plan for the next one.

It was the only choice, because they had to cut it down to 21 districts somehow.

05-20-2002, 01:04 PM	#1
Chewbaccus Freethinker/booter Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 523	Questions of Rendell Now, as the elders of this hallowed institution have, for reasons known only to them, stayed in Philadelphia for extended periods of time, I think it only fair I post this question to them: How shady was Rendell, really? ~mike __________________ Like the wise man said: Of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.

05-20-2002, 02:44 PM	#3
MaggieL in the Hour of Scampering Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Jeffersonville PA (15 mi NW of Philadelphia) Posts: 4,060	Rendell has made one move that may have been a serious mistake: by taking a position for expanding gun control in the state, he's alienated a lot of folks outside the Democratic strongholds in the big cities. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. __________________ "Neither can his Mind be thought to be in Tune,whose words do jarre; nor his reason In frame, whose sentence is preposterous..."

05-20-2002, 10:29 PM	#9
MaggieL in the Hour of Scampering Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Jeffersonville PA (15 mi NW of Philadelphia) Posts: 4,060	Note that at no point do they actually claim that Lawless is a Philadelphian....only that he knows Philly, with a lot of symbolic claptrap. He isn't a Philly boy...he's local to Tony and my neck of the woods in western Montgomery County; as far as I can see he's never actually lived in the city proper. He was in fact a local rabble rouser who was elected to the state house as a Republican but who switched affiliations last year. __________________ "Neither can his Mind be thought to be in Tune,whose words do jarre; nor his reason In frame, whose sentence is preposterous..."

05-20-2002, 01:34 PM	#2
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Not shady at all, especially in comparison to every Philadelphia mayorship before and since. And with the fact that he had to push out some deeply powerful unions in order to privatize, you'd think it would have been much, much worse. Rendell's one of the finer pols going. Casey Jr. (his opponent for the D governors primary here) is an empty suit whose reign as Auditor General was marked by Nothing Much. The only time he ever got big press was in criticizing the Philadelphia shipyard deal -- a spit at then-Gov. Tom Ridge and future opponent Rendell. But he criticized it two years after the hands were shook, so it was meaningless and totally political. I urge you to vote Rendell if you have the opportunity.

05-20-2002, 02:59 PM	#4
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Yes, as soon as one single-issue gun rights voter considers doing something other than pulling the straight R lever, that will become important.

05-20-2002, 03:07 PM	#5
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	OK, on second thought, that's unfair. There are maybe 5% single-issue voters who would consider voting for a D over an R, but the multi-issue voters can be swayed at a greater rate.

05-20-2002, 03:19 PM	#6
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	One other thing for Pennsylvania Ds: don't be fooled into voting for Lawless for Lt. Governor. The guy should be returned to private live A.S.A.P. In my opinion.

05-20-2002, 06:02 PM	#7
elSicomoro Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 12,486	I didn't want to vote for Rendell just b/c he's from Philadelphia. By the time I moved here, the Village Idiot was in charge (John Street). Casey seems to be trading on his father's name, and I definitely don't like his positions on abortion and the minimum wage. I like Rendell's background as D.A. and Mayor, I like his stances, and I particularly like the persona, in that he seems to walk his own walk. Fumo hates him (Fumo's a tool), Street seems cold to him (also a tool), and Ed pissed people off in the Democratic Party (while he was running it no less) with the election aftermath. Yep, I gotta go with big Ed. Incidentally, this will be my first PA election. I didn't register early enough for the Presidential election, and this is the first place I've lived in which you do not receive a notice by mail for voting. My bad. But, with a Daily News in hand, I now know where I go to vote in my neighborhood. (The beer distributor had no Inkys, and I wanted to read the little debate Smerconish was having with a city resident...it's an interesting piece.)

05-20-2002, 10:59 PM	#10
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	I ran across him, yeah, several times. But here are two stories that basically sum this guy up. Lawless made a big deal about how prisoners in state prisons get cable TV cheap because the prisons negotiate bulk deals with the cable franchises. After a few weeks of ranting and raving on the topic, Lawless finally visited Graterford, the local state lock-up. After seeing how things are there, and having the warden explain that he liked the prisoners having cable because it keeps them occupied and thus not raping and killing each other, Lawless basically slunk away quietly. Lawless hates the state college system and spends a lot of time messing with it. The last time he took an interest, he heard that Penn State students were scheduling a "sex faire" -- basically, a mostly-harmless informational event that they decided to put on. Figuring he could incilte media coverage and get free publicity, Lawless put out press releases and such, tracking them down to ensure that they weren't using any state funds to put on the event. When they held it on campus, Lawless demanded that the event be banned and students held responsible because some extra money must have gone to maintenance and janitorial costs because of it.

05-21-2002, 02:40 PM	#11
russotto Professor Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 1,788	I don't know, Tony; that first Lawless story actually puts him above most politicians. Most wouldn't care what the actual situation at the prison was, just how good the sound bite sounded. As for Rendell... ugh. I remember Schaefer in MD. Considered a decent Mayor, but earned the title Governor of Baltimore for his antics in that office. And as a non-Philadelphian, I'd be concerned that he'd raise taxes statewide to throw funds at Philadelphia.

05-21-2002, 05:49 PM	#13
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Anyway, on seeing the turnout at our local precinct, Rendell is sure to win this thing, and the Casey era may be over. Which would be a great thing. Y'see, the only reason Casey Sr. won was because he had a certain Democratic strategist on his side: one James Carville. They concocted and ran a last-minute ad attacking their Republican opponent for his teenage indulgence in Transcendental Meditation, and won. It was an incredible ad. It was the lowest thing I have ever seen. They found pics of the guy in long hair on his college campus and blew them up for the screen. Fake newspaper headlines, scary professional announcer, the whole nine yards. And it was utterly effective, scaring the public silly and causing them to vote for Casey Sr. as the very last minute. I mean the whole thing was timed perfectly. The ad ran the weekend before the election. There was no time for reporters to get a reaction, no time for editorial writers to write about it or question it. The Casey Sr. victory made Carville the rising star of political consultants, eventually leading to his management, and victory, of the campaign of Clinton '92. The Casey Sr. victory also created political shockwaves when they wondered whether there was a new streak of Democrats who were pro-life. There weren't; it was just a big loser, who should have lost but for the meanest, most vicious campaign manager ever to walk the earth.

05-21-2002, 06:13 PM	#15
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	It WAS ruled unconstitutional, but then somehow someone also ruled that there wasn't enough time to draw up a new plan in time for the primaries, and that hysteria would reign. So they decided that they would just go with the new plan for this election, and then draw up a new new plan for the next one. It was the only choice, because they had to cut it down to 21 districts somehow.

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