The North Korea thread.

[glatt]

What the hell is going on over there?

First they sink the South Korean ship, but deny it.
Then South Korea plays war games close to the disputed border.
Then North Korea shells a South Korean island scores of times, killing some people.
And South Korea shells North Korea about double that amount. Damage unknown.

Oh, and this is just after the North shows off a new nuke facility to a western scientist.

Is it just saber rattling, or are we on the verge of a serious fucking war? Should the US do anything, or are we spread too thin already and have enough problems at home? How many simultaneous wars can we fight? At least Iraq is basically over.

North Korea is a backwards ass country, but they are heavily fortified. We can't just go in there. They have a fort on every hill.

What the fuck? I want my peace back.

[Spexxvet]

I hope someone else takes the lead, if there is violence. Certainly China has more influence on NK than we do.

[Lamplighter]

Unfortunately, Jimmy Carter is getting too old to always be our behind-the-scenes negotiator for the US,
and I don't think Hillary has the personal contacts with the NK family to take his place.
Once again they will probably have to call on the Russians and Chinese to keep the peace.

[piercehawkeye45]

Everything I have read has suggested this is just North Korea acting like a little who is looking for attention. Apparently NK is not happy with Obama and SK so they are taking it out this way. Also, with the power transition from Kim Jong-Il to his son happening in the next couple of years I would guess they wouldn't try to start an all out war but you never know.

China would be against an all out war so they would probably stop it from escalating too far.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by piercehawkeye45

Apparently NK is not happy with Obama and SK so they are taking it out this way.

Apparently NK doesn't think Obama has the cajones to do anything about it.
I think its more of a timing issue. We are already spread too thin, Obama is now in re-election mode and its not something the west can really afford to get involved in militarily. It sucks all the way around.

[Clodfobble]

I would think it has less to do with the West, and more to do with making sure no one thinks that there's a power vacuum when the dictatorship transfers to the son. Maybe they're just trying to remind everyone that the son is just as much of a badass as the father is...

[Bullitt]

I think you're onto something there Clod.

[piercehawkeye45]

Originally Posted by classicman

I think its more of a timing issue. We are already spread too thin, Obama is now in re-election mode and its not something the west can really afford to get involved in militarily. It sucks all the way around.

If it was a timing issue than what would be the incentive for an attack on South Korea? It obviously wasn't self defense. North Korea is making excuses. Also, I'm sure NK knows that the US will not go to war unless an all out war develops so I don't think that factor will have much effect on NK's decision making.

NK recently showed their new nuclear facility to a US nuclear scientist. I don't understand any other reason for doing this unless they are trying to call attention to themselves. Also:

One of the analysts who linked the North’s action to food aid was Choi Jin-wook, a North Korea expert at the Korea Institute for National Unification, a research institute in Seoul. “It’s a sign of North Korea’s increasing frustration,” Mr. Choi said.

“Washington has turned a deaf ear to Pyongyang and North Korea is saying, ‘Look here. We’re still alive. We can cause trouble. You can’t ignore us.’ ”

Mr. Choi said North Korea had become frustrated over the Obama administration’s refusal to remove a broad range of sanctions against the regime for its continuing nuclear efforts.

“They see that they can’t pressure Washington,” he said, “so they’ve taken South Korea hostage again.”

“They’re in a desperate situation, and they want food immediately, not next year,” he said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/24/wo..._r=1&ref=world


I'm sure my opinion will change as more information comes out but right now I personally think it is a cry for attention and a front for the transition of power to Kim Jong-Il's son.

[Gravdigr]

I have nothing to back this up, it's just an opinion.

I believe NKorea to be in about the same shape as the USSR toward the end. I doubt NKorea has the wherewithall to actually pull off a protracted engagement of any kind. Prolly don't have enough fuel or ammo. Military might might be highly exaggerated.

[footfootfoot]

Food is popular, even more so with those who haven't got it. I suspect it is a combination of food and the upcoming transfer of power. Although if the son has 1/8th of a brain as soon as his dad kicks it, he should open up his country and be the biggest fucking hero that ever lived.

[tw]

Originally Posted by Clodfobble

I would think it has less to do with the West, and more to do with making sure no one thinks that there's a power vacuum when the dictatorship transfers to the son.

This is, by far, a more reasonable answer. However, we don't know if this is the father shaking the tree to make his son look strong. It may also be the power brokers reminding the son who really is in charge.

When the father got sick, we don't know who was making decisions. But that is when N Korea did many belligerent activities.

Remember, George Jr was also only a front man. He did not really make decisions. In China, the People's Army also acts independent of the Central government. That was most obvious during the silly spy plane incident. In Iran, Ahmadinejad does not make decision; only puts forth an image. Same may be ongoing in N Korea. We just don't know, with certainty, who really is in charge. But as Clod accurately notes, it is more about saying who holds the power. We just do not know who is really doing the talking.

[fo0hzy]

Originally Posted by tw

Remember, George Jr was also only a front man. He did not really make decisions..

Seriously?

For fuck's sake...

Lame, lame lame lame

[Griff]

It crossed my mind that NK may have a new weapons system they want to test out, so a lot of ships and planes buzzing around could be useful. Iran would probably purchase anything that could humble an aircraft carrier.

[freshnesschronic]

We are providing defenses for South Korea
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/us_korea_north1

INCHEON, South Korea (Reuters) – A U.S. aircraft carrier group set off for Korean waters on Wednesday, a day after North Korea rained artillery shells on a South Korean island, in a move likely to enrage Pyongyang and unsettle its ally, China.

[freshnesschronic]

I'm no expert on the Korean war or any international relations, but a crazy thing is that all the Koreans are the same people...Koreans are a homogeneous people for centuries but to think that they hate each other so much over ideological philosophies....Maybe it's just me heh.