So, what is the difference.... - Page 4

MaggieL · 07-20-2006, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayMcGee

mmmm.... the attackers are hiding amongst the (relatively) innocent? But, presumably, not very well ...

Well enough to elicit maximum propiganda value, that being their pupose. But this time even Hezbullah's usual friends (as distinct from their direct patrons in Syria and Iran) in the region aren't so strongly behind them as they usually are.

Maybe they know something you don't. Or maybe they're just not as dogmatically encumbered...now wouldn't that be ironic.

JayMcGee · 07-20-2006, 06:13 PM

Perhaps, dar, but I'm not the one liviing in Neverland.

JayMcGee · 07-20-2006, 08:41 PM

I'm sure the 100 plus Lebannese children kiilled and maimed appreciate the irony...

MaggieL · 07-22-2006, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayMcGee

I'm sure the 100 plus Lebannese children kiilled and maimed appreciate the irony...

Of course they are victims. The problem is you're confused as to who victimized them. Diagnosis is still terminal myopia. Prognosis not improving.

The only upside is that (as UT pointed out elsewhere), Hezbollah will say they are now eligible to be considered martyrs (albeit involuntary and retroactive) because they are not Jewish.

If they aren't. Surely at least some of them are Christian, which presumably makes them "infidel Crusaders who deservered what they got".

JayMcGee · 07-22-2006, 06:18 PM

you're all heart, maggiel...... and a stone one at that.

Are all Americans like you, reducing the deaths of non-American children to mere 'point-scorers' in an Interenet forum?

xoxoxoBruce · 07-22-2006, 06:28 PM

Lebannese children should not be harmed, because they are humans and humans should not be harmed.......except the ones on my list.

MaggieL · 07-22-2006, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayMcGee

you're all heart, maggiel...... and a stone one at that.

A heart is of no use without a brain.

Perhaps it makes you feel all warm and morally superior, but if you're unable to see who is actually responsible for their pain, your no doubt deeply-felt liberal sympathy does the victims no good...in fact it is an obstacle to preventing this from happening again.

The same applies to your shallowly-reasoned accusations of heartlessness.

JayMcGee · 07-22-2006, 06:43 PM

No-one can do the victims any good, maggie, 'cos they're dead.

I'm just trying to stir you into some kind of action that may be can prevent more victims. Don't you have this 'megan's law' thingie over there in some of your states? If you can legislate and act over the death of one child, why can you not act over the death of hundreds of children?

xoxoxoBruce · 07-22-2006, 06:55 PM

You seem to be confused. Maggie, and many of us, are in the USA, not Israel. You, on the other hand, are considerably closer to Lebanon than we.

Maybe it's you that should be stirred to do something for the children.

MaggieL · 07-23-2006, 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayMcGee

No-one can do the victims any good, maggie, 'cos they're dead.

That's moronic. Not all the victims are dead.

Beyond those injured nonfatally or economically or by having their property destroyed or loved ones killed, there are other future victims who can yet be helped by preventing the status quo ante from continuing.

That is an opportunity that was lost once before...had it not been, even the now-dead fatalities of the current fighting might have been saved. Now you're working hard against the interests of the next set

JayMcGee · 07-22-2006, 07:14 PM

oxo, I 've tried kicking Tony's ass, but all I did was stub my toe.

Realistically, onyl the US can reign in Isreal, and Bush not only won't but has implicitely given Israel free reign for the next week or so. How many more kids will be killed in this next week?

MaggieL · 07-23-2006, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayMcGee

Realistically, onyl the US can reign in Isreal.

Here's where we see how important spelling can be.

The US won't reign in Israel.

It might rein-in Israel.

Words matter...in this case a homophone deeply changes the meaning of a sentence.

Griff · 07-23-2006, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayMcGee

Realistically, onyl the US can reign in Isreal, ...

I don't know Jay, you may be right, but sometimes I wonder which government is the other's sock puppet. Many Americans have a very strange sense of patriotism, valuing Likuds vision of what is good for Israel over what would be good for the US. The interesting thing is the arguments among Israelis about what is good for Israel appear, at least from here, to be much more open and realistic than the arguments in the States. If it makes you feel better, the neo-com crowd here thinks a wider war=peace and freedom. All you need to do is track down their Kool-Ade supplier and you'll be golden. That said, Israel is in a bad spot, which can only be improved by strengthening Lebanon's internal security, unfortunately that ship has probably already sailed.

tw · 07-23-2006, 08:55 PM

There will be no ceasefire. Israel will invade Lebanon. Israel is simply waiting for a right time (politically) and maybe for a good excuse. In fact, I expected them to start tonight (Sunday night) because it would create less hype - less adverse reaction than later in the week.

There is no doubt of Israel's intent to cleanse 20 miles into Lebanon. Drive out everyone - innocents and Hezbollah alike. Then withdraw only when Lebanon's army occupies the border. But Lebanon threw a monkey wrench (shrewdly) into Israel's plans. Lebanon said the army would have to attack invading Israelis according to constitutional requirements. That rather stunned the Israelis and may have delayed the Lebanon invasion.

Israel is simply looking for cover to justify their obvious strategic objective - cleanse 20 miles into Lebanon. Literally drive all Lebanonese residents - Hezbollah and innocent civilians alike - for a 20 mile DMZ.

Israel can do so. The United States has told Israel to do just this and is running cover for an Israeli invasion. US is not playing honest broker. We have already declared Hezbollah as our enemy (like Saddam) - just not so publicly. Unlike all previous administrations, this one has defined the entire world in terms of 'good and evil'. No negotiation. As soon as time is right, we will either attack or send a proxy to attack that party, region, minority, or nation. We even play games with words such as nation and terrorist organization just to confuse a mostly ill informed American public with Rush Limbaugh type rhetoric.

No longer is anything to be solved by negotiation. This administration has decided to fix the world whether the world likes it or not - first with military solutions and unilateral attacks.

Only a matter of time before Israel invades. There will be no political or negotiated settlement. Welcome to a new world order that George Sr never envisioned and yet was defined in the Wolfovich paper that also defined unilateral attacks on India, Russia, or Germany. Do you understand why Putin in Russia is becoming so uncooperative and cautious? Why he is reinforcing his 'energy' weapons? Why free speech and the two houses of Parliament in Russia must be subverted?

The unanswerable question is whether Israel will also use this attack to 'soften' Syrian forces. To accidentally execute a major pre-emptive strike on Syria. Remember, the only adjacent nations that Israel will not attack are Jordan, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia - and only because America says who they must and cannot attack. Don't for one minute think these leaders are reacting to world events. They now have specific intentions that they would rather you do not understand.

Feel the wind. Something has clearly changed. If you don't feel it, then you are not paying attention to current events.

MaggieL · 07-23-2006, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tw

We have already declared Hezbollah as our enemy (like Saddam) - just not so publicly.

Tell that to the Marines.

07-20-2006, 06:13 PM	#2
JayMcGee Cardigan-wearing man Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Much Binding In The Marsh Posts: 1,082	Perhaps, dar, but I'm not the one liviing in Neverland. __________________ I like wearing cardigans...... my current favourite is an orange cable-knit with real leatherette buttons.

07-20-2006, 08:41 PM	#3
JayMcGee Cardigan-wearing man Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Much Binding In The Marsh Posts: 1,082	I'm sure the 100 plus Lebannese children kiilled and maimed appreciate the irony... __________________ I like wearing cardigans...... my current favourite is an orange cable-knit with real leatherette buttons.

07-22-2006, 06:18 PM	#5
JayMcGee Cardigan-wearing man Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Much Binding In The Marsh Posts: 1,082	you're all heart, maggiel...... and a stone one at that. Are all Americans like you, reducing the deaths of non-American children to mere 'point-scorers' in an Interenet forum? __________________ I like wearing cardigans...... my current favourite is an orange cable-knit with real leatherette buttons.

07-22-2006, 06:28 PM	#6
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Lebannese children should not be harmed, because they are humans and humans should not be harmed.......except the ones on my list. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

07-22-2006, 06:43 PM	#8
JayMcGee Cardigan-wearing man Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Much Binding In The Marsh Posts: 1,082	No-one can do the victims any good, maggie, 'cos they're dead. I'm just trying to stir you into some kind of action that may be can prevent more victims. Don't you have this 'megan's law' thingie over there in some of your states? If you can legislate and act over the death of one child, why can you not act over the death of hundreds of children? __________________ I like wearing cardigans...... my current favourite is an orange cable-knit with real leatherette buttons.

07-22-2006, 06:55 PM	#9
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	You seem to be confused. Maggie, and many of us, are in the USA, not Israel. You, on the other hand, are considerably closer to Lebanon than we. Maybe it's you that should be stirred to do something for the children. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

07-22-2006, 07:14 PM	#11
JayMcGee Cardigan-wearing man Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Much Binding In The Marsh Posts: 1,082	oxo, I 've tried kicking Tony's ass, but all I did was stub my toe. Realistically, onyl the US can reign in Isreal, and Bush not only won't but has implicitely given Israel free reign for the next week or so. How many more kids will be killed in this next week? __________________ I like wearing cardigans...... my current favourite is an orange cable-knit with real leatherette buttons.

07-23-2006, 08:55 PM	#14
tw Read? I only know how to write. Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 11,933	There will be no ceasefire. Israel will invade Lebanon. Israel is simply waiting for a right time (politically) and maybe for a good excuse. In fact, I expected them to start tonight (Sunday night) because it would create less hype - less adverse reaction than later in the week. There is no doubt of Israel's intent to cleanse 20 miles into Lebanon. Drive out everyone - innocents and Hezbollah alike. Then withdraw only when Lebanon's army occupies the border. But Lebanon threw a monkey wrench (shrewdly) into Israel's plans. Lebanon said the army would have to attack invading Israelis according to constitutional requirements. That rather stunned the Israelis and may have delayed the Lebanon invasion. Israel is simply looking for cover to justify their obvious strategic objective - cleanse 20 miles into Lebanon. Literally drive all Lebanonese residents - Hezbollah and innocent civilians alike - for a 20 mile DMZ. Israel can do so. The United States has told Israel to do just this and is running cover for an Israeli invasion. US is not playing honest broker. We have already declared Hezbollah as our enemy (like Saddam) - just not so publicly. Unlike all previous administrations, this one has defined the entire world in terms of 'good and evil'. No negotiation. As soon as time is right, we will either attack or send a proxy to attack that party, region, minority, or nation. We even play games with words such as nation and terrorist organization just to confuse a mostly ill informed American public with Rush Limbaugh type rhetoric. No longer is anything to be solved by negotiation. This administration has decided to fix the world whether the world likes it or not - first with military solutions and unilateral attacks. Only a matter of time before Israel invades. There will be no political or negotiated settlement. Welcome to a new world order that George Sr never envisioned and yet was defined in the Wolfovich paper that also defined unilateral attacks on India, Russia, or Germany. Do you understand why Putin in Russia is becoming so uncooperative and cautious? Why he is reinforcing his 'energy' weapons? Why free speech and the two houses of Parliament in Russia must be subverted? The unanswerable question is whether Israel will also use this attack to 'soften' Syrian forces. To accidentally execute a major pre-emptive strike on Syria. Remember, the only adjacent nations that Israel will not attack are Jordan, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia - and only because America says who they must and cannot attack. Don't for one minute think these leaders are reacting to world events. They now have specific intentions that they would rather you do not understand. Feel the wind. Something has clearly changed. If you don't feel it, then you are not paying attention to current events.

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